It really pains me to say this  

RE: It really pains me to say this

I think the Prusa steel beds are the single most important differentiating feature and make 3D printing amazing instead of annoying. That said, I had the same issue when I first got mine and the manual doesn't cover it adequately. You have to scuff up the surface quite a lot or nothing will stick to it. I used red Scotchbrite pretty vigorously to get mine to stick similar to the scrubby in the first post. Once roughed up, it needs no prep at all. I just occasionally hit it with windex and a cloth and that's it. Been working great since.

RE: It really pains me to say this

I’ve printed a lot of PETG and ABS on the textured sheet but never PLA, because of the bad press it‘s getting. Last night I thought what the heck, let’s give it a try. 9 hours later, with standard Generic PLA, 0.2 mm quality profiles, and just a good swipe of the bed with 99% isopropyl alcohol, it came out great, no problems sticking to the plate.

I guess some batches of the textured sheets are great, others not so.

RE: It really pains me to say this

Posted by: @thomas-k-reed

I assure you I have tried every combination of cleaning possible over the last 3 weeks and the results are the same.

I really think that there's been enough anecdotal evidence presented here over the past 9 months or so to conclude that there are some 'good' and some 'bad' Prusa textured sheets, and they may or may not correlate with manufacturer and/or batch.

I apparently got one of the 'good' ones, as it's behaved as expected since I got it.  Mine has the code WA-15 in the upper right corner.

I think that SOME of the reported issues have to do with sheets that are not Really Most Sincerely Clean, but that some are the result of the sheets themselves being sub-par.

Among the things I've noticed about the textured sheets are the fact that the Z calibration is more critical than with the smooth sheets, and that the number on the Z calibration tends to be significantly lower than for the smooth sheets.  Another thing is that the adhesion is more tricky than with the smooth sheets, particularly when printing with PLA.  I've found that an adhesion helper such as the Layerneer Bed Weld (I'll spare you the agony of viewing the photo of the bottle this time, but just this once!) 😉 really helps with PLA prints and with any prints that have a small footprint or use small and detailed supports.  It helps PLA prints to stick and it's a great release agent for PETg and ABS.

I totally 'get it' regarding the frustration with these sheets.  When I first got the sheet (I had never printed on a textured sheet until I got my Prusa and ordered the textured sheet as an add-on) I was trying to dial in the Z calibration and I thought for a while that something was wrong.  I was dialing the Z lower and lower and lower with only so-so improvement and I was thinking that if it went on much longer I would run the nozzle right into the sheet and ruin it!  Fortunately things settled in, and the corners of the traces became square and the patch filled in nicely.

RE: It really pains me to say this

I really think it's a QA issue...the breadth of reviews and comments I'm reading appears to bear that theory out.

I have pulled my hair out, the little i have left,  since the day I got the sheet trying to make it work.  I don't know how much filament I've wasted.

Sometimes...i'd venture 60%? of the time small PLA prints near the middle of the plate stick OK...there is a little peeling but mostly it's something I can live with.

Things near the edge of the plate, 95% of the time break away mid-print or just don't stick at all...I have had maybe one success in 10s of prints on that plate with PLA with smaller objects near the edge, even with brims.  I print lots of duplicate small things for my table top RPG group so it's important to me to print in volume and utilize the full build plate.

A few weeks ago i was printing big models, buildings for  my group, that extended all the way to almost the edge of the print area.  I though I had solved the adhesion issue by bumping the bed temp 10C.  At first I thought they were printing ok, and they did complete, but on further inspection the corners had peeled away and warped.  which isn't a huge deal, but still a bit annoying.

On that note,  i did some temp measurements on the plate with an infrared thermometer.   I found that the reading in the the center parts of the plate is a good 8-10C lower than the set temp of the printer..and near the edge..maybe a whole inch or so inside the outlined "print area"  the temp can drop off 20C from the bed temp setting.  I would image that has something to do with the issue I am experiencing.  Maybe that's normal, i dunno.

Anyways, I'll stick by my initial statement that it's not suitable for PLA, at least consistently, and I've learned that the 3rd party plates actually do what the Prusa plate claims to do.

RE: It really pains me to say this

The biggest frustration to me has been Prusa's lack of response to the consistency issue with these sheets. I'm not even that bummed that I'm out the money after waiting over 14 months for the blasted thing. It's the crappy scripted response from support and Prusa's subsequent ninja editing of the support pages that rubs me the wrong way. Let folks know there are issues, stop advertising it for PLA. Don't go the revisionist route and hope nobody notices.

RE: It really pains me to say this

I've had mixed success with the textured sheets.

With PETG, no issues.

PLA and PLA+, I've increased bed temp, reduced bed temp, increased filament temp on first layer, added cooling, lowered the nozzle, raised the nozzle...

I've scrubbed the sheet with de-greaser, with IPA, with Windex, soap and water.

The glue stick was my best solution, for a while. I made a solution of PVA (white glue) and water and was able to paint a thin layer onto the sheet. This lasts quite a while and provides enough grip for the PLA to stick solidly.

Let's also keep in mind that the relative humidity here is 50% indoors here and close to 75% outdoors. Something sticky is needed to keep things on the plate.

RE: It really pains me to say this

Got my BCZAMD textured sheet delivered last week. I went with BCZAMD over THEKKIINNGG because of slightly better reviews on Amazon. Since then I’ve printed a fair bit of PLA and PETG. PETG is equal to the Prusa textured sheet. PLA is much better. Not a single issue with adhesion, and it comes off easily when cooled down. The bottom pattern looks much coarser than what you get from the Prusa sheet. I’m not a huge fan of it but maybe that’s why it works better, and in my book, performance beats looks. 

RE: It really pains me to say this

Posted by: @fuchsr

Got my BCZAMD textured sheet delivered last week. I went with BCZAMD over THEKKIINNGG because of slightly better reviews on Amazon. Since then I’ve printed a fair bit of PLA and PETG. PETG is equal to the Prusa textured sheet. PLA is much better. Not a single issue with adhesion, and it comes off easily when cooled down. The bottom pattern looks much coarser than what you get from the Prusa sheet. I’m not a huge fan of it but maybe that’s why it works better, and in my book, performance beats looks. 

Thanks.

I'm assuming that you're reporting on this one here, correct?

https://www.amazon.com/BCZAMD-Double-Textured-Spring-Powder/dp/B07XC673ZT/

The one textured sheet I have is getting a lot of use and one side is indeed showing some wear and tear.  I'm thinking of ordering another but I'm leery of getting a bad one. I do like the texture of the surface it gives.

One question: What is your opinion of the feel and strength of the sheet compared to the Prusa? I have held off ordering the KKIINNGG sheet due to reviews (here? Amazon? RepRap? forget) saying that it was flimsy and tended to crease when removing large prints.

RE: It really pains me to say this

Posted by: @jsw

Posted by: @fuchsr

Got my BCZAMD textured sheet delivered last week. I went with BCZAMD over THEKKIINNGG because of slightly better reviews on Amazon. Since then I’ve printed a fair bit of PLA and PETG. PETG is equal to the Prusa textured sheet. PLA is much better. Not a single issue with adhesion, and it comes off easily when cooled down. The bottom pattern looks much coarser than what you get from the Prusa sheet. I’m not a huge fan of it but maybe that’s why it works better, and in my book, performance beats looks. 

Thanks.

I'm assuming that you're reporting on this one here, correct?

https://www.amazon.com/BCZAMD-Double-Textured-Spring-Powder/dp/B07XC673ZT/

The one textured sheet I have is getting a lot of use and one side is indeed showing some wear and tear.  I'm thinking of ordering another but I'm leery of getting a bad one. I do like the texture of the surface it gives.

One question: What is your opinion of the feel and strength of the sheet compared to the Prusa? I have held off ordering the KKIINNGG sheet due to reviews (here? Amazon? RepRap? forget) saying that it was flimsy and tended to crease when removing large prints.

Yes, I will post my findings of BCZAMD’s Textured sheet tonight.  

RE: It really pains me to say this

Posted by: @fuchsr

Got my BCZAMD textured sheet delivered last week. I went with BCZAMD over THEKKIINNGG because of slightly better reviews on Amazon. Since then I’ve printed a fair bit of PLA and PETG. PETG is equal to the Prusa textured sheet. PLA is much better. Not a single issue with adhesion, and it comes off easily when cooled down. The bottom pattern looks much coarser than what you get from the Prusa sheet. I’m not a huge fan of it but maybe that’s why it works better, and in my book, performance beats looks. 

Maybe I should change my head to head and go with the BCZAMD vs. TheKKIINNGG.  Any suggestions?  

RE: It really pains me to say this

Beware some of the real cheap knock-off sheets. This FYSETC clone couldn't stand up to the frantic pace of printing PPE in PETG 7x24 earlier this year. Mind you, it gripped well, much as friction tape might.

RE: It really pains me to say this

@bobstro

Wow, that is terrible.  I will have to see if my sheet does this.    

RE: It really pains me to say this

@jsw

Yes, that's the one I ordered.

Feel and strength compared to Prusa:

It's halfway between the smooth and the textured Prusa sheets. With my calipers I measure the smooth sheet at 1.3 mm, the textured at 0.6 mm. The BCZAMD measures at 0.95. It feels sturdy. Of course, only long term use will show how durable it is. 

RE: It really pains me to say this

@fuchsr

Hopefully, they have improved.  The weakness I saw with this on my MK3S was durability.  It started coming off the plate after about a month.  

RE: It really pains me to say this

At least with this manufacturer they note (on the Amazon page):

"After-sales guarantee: each defective item can be replacement for free or refund. If any question, please feel free to contact or QA us, we will try our best to service you."

I would assume that if I got one like the one pictured above and it started to flake off within a reasonable time and a reasonable number of prints, they would replace it and not give me that 'it's a consumable' song and dance.

RE: It really pains me to say this

Posted by: @jsw

[...] I would assume that if I got one like the one pictured above and it started to flake off within a reasonable time and a reasonable number of prints, they would replace it and not give me that 'it's a consumable' song and dance.

I should clarify: That sheet was pressed into "death march mode" printing PPE with PETG at 80C for many, many 24x7 stints. At one point, I couldn't take proper care of it so just slathered on some glue stick, snapped frames off the hot sheet as soon as the prints finished, and fired up the next print during the overnight wakeups. It was definitely higher usage and more abusive conditions than normal. That said, I still don't particularly like the sheet or the finish. I didn't bother contacting the manufacturer as I chalk it up to abuse on my part.

RE: It really pains me to say this

I wanted to provide an update based on the 2 other sheets I ordered and give am impression of them both since I've probably done roughly the same amount of printing on them as my original prusa pc sheet -

Got a great deal on a bulk buy of some hatchbox PLA , that's what all these results were printed with ...

My normal routine in cleaning the plate is a few generous squirts of Windex between prints (enough that it foams a bit), then thoroughly dried with a new paper towel.  and about every 5th print or so a scotch-brite and dawn. I print full sheets of parts every go - many times the same parts over multiple prints.

First the matterhackers sheet - 

This sheet has kind of a gold finish and is a little more coarse than the Prusa sheet.  It's a nice thickness ~1mm at all the points I measured vs Prusa at ~.70.  It was difficult for me to measure accurately as it was mid print on something and I couldn't take it of.  It has about the same amount of flex as the Prusa sheet as far as I can tell.

The sheet was ridiculously adhesive on the first few prints...in fact I had trouble getting the first layer calibration square off of it.  Even when completely cool to room temperature it didn't want to let go.  This lasted about 4 prints.  Then it came around to what I would call a normal adhesion.  After cooling barely any force was needed to dislodge the pieces.

Over the next 5 or so prints it began to lose it's grip a bit, I did the dawn - then windex thing and it seems to have returned to 'normal' adhesion, though nothing like it's first  few.  overall It's still working fine if cleaned per my normal routine.

Next the 'TTHHEE KKIINNGG' sheet -

Darker finish than both the prusa and the matterhackers sheet, which makes it exceptionally hard to calibrate with dark filament.  I would say the texture is about on par with the Prusa sheet, maybe a little finer.  It's thickness measured in around~63mm.  Though close to the same thickness of the Prusa sheet, it feels much more 'flimsy' .

First few prints went well.  I again experienced the 'super adhesion' the first few rounds, nothing close to the matterhackers sheet, but they were stuck very nicely.  This one seemed to go a lot farther before it require the dawn/scotchbrite treatment, maybe 8 or so more prints.  Then the regular routine restored it back to a normal adhesion.

Once it's cooled down now the prints often just fall off as I'm removing the plate.  Very easy release.

This sheet seems to go through more cycles before a soap and water cleaning is required.

If i had to choose one I'd go with the tthheekkiinngg sheet and it seems to require he least maintenance.  Though it is a bit flimsy and I'm not sure that will be my same opinion in 3-4 months.

Overall the 2 3rd party sheets are much better than the Prusa sheet, that now sits on my shelf as a reminder to research products before you buy them  - even from a brand you trust. 

RE: It really pains me to say this

A few more days of printing with the BCZAMD sheet... Printed all sorts of PLA stuff, everything stuck perfectly while printing and popped right off when cooled down. A bit of PETG as well, same (positive) story. Today I printed some ABS. Almost impossible to get off the sheet. It took me forever and I was afraid I’d damage the sheet. Next time I’ll try Layerneer as a separating agent. 

RE: It really pains me to say this

Time in the freezer will help get stuck parts off the sheet.

RE: It really pains me to say this

@fuchsr

The issue you are likly to get with that sheet is that you are gonna start pulling PEI off eventually with prints.