About ready to toss this thing...  

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

hey jason the printer is sweet I love mine. If you aren't getting good results there must be something wrong with yer printer man. did you build it from the kit or buy it pre-built ?

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Don't despair. It should be just a matter of troubleshooting for the root cause. Did you buy the kit or did you get it pre-assembled? I purchased the kit from Voxel Factory in Montreal QC & started printing on the first day. All the Prusa supplied gcode models on the SD card printed successfully for me using the supplied colorFabb PLA/PHA filament. On the other hand, slicing the .stl models with Slic3r or Simplify3d required a significant amount of tweaking to get things right. I can provide you the .FFF files if that would help. Can you provide a few photos of the problem(s) you are seeing?

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

It can be very frustrating when things don't go right and you end up with a mess of spaghetti instead. I'm new to printing but have learned quite a lot the past couple of weeks while getting mine up and running.

One thing I have noticed initially, it was very difficult to get things to stick to the build plate, and things would move and the machine would go into spaghetti mode. I cleaned a few times with isopropyl alcohol and gave it some elbow grease using a paper towel, to make sure it was super clean. This helped and prints began to stick.

The other important thing I did to improve things was to calibrate the extruder and I got most of my info from http://shop.prusa3d.com/forum/prusa-i3-kit-building-calibrating-first-print-main-f6/extruder-calibration-t2033.html#p16294 , which explains about calculating the steps. It sounded complicated when I first read it, but things became clear once I started. I found it easier to measure 110mm from where the filament goes into the head and then extrude 100mm and measure how far it had moved. Also I heard the extruder skips few times which made a mess of the the readings. To solve this I just increased the temperature about 10-15 degree, so that it would extrude easier. I did have to increase the extrusion quite a bit from the factory settings, which has also helped make things stick.

I found setting the initial z-height using live z -adjustment difficult and still do as its difficult to see without a magnifier. Anyway, I just kept running the v2 calibration code, and slowing it down by turning the encoder when it started to give me more time. After a couple of runs I got it to print with good definition.

I think the clean bed and extruder calibrations are probably the two biggest snags to start with a new printer, assuming the bed is level and no other problem. Once these are resolved it is a case of tinkering and learning about the material and adjusting the temps accordingly.

Anyway, if you've read so far down, you may see that initial problems can be overcome and others have been there too. I do hope you keep it and dont throw it out. It can be frustrating, sure, but its also very rewarding when things do start to go right.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

jason.c2 there is a lot of help here.
If you bought your printer ready built directly from Prusa Research, you have direct support from Prusa Research contact them.

Meanwhile there is a lot of help available here.

3D printers are not like bought over the shelf HP text and photo printers. A learning curve is needed due to thermodynamics and use of materials. Its not rocket science, but 3D printing is not mainstream and an out of the box experience right now. See Makers Muse on youtube.
Just my take of the state of 3D printing now.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

It looks like you've only made this post and nothing else- how can you expect help if you didn't ask first? Theres alot of people here that are willing to step forward. I'm just trying to understand your logic. No way of telling what's wrong and it could be something so simple but unexplored or an actual defect that could be quickly resolved, but cant do that unless you want to. Good luck man.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Clearly you got a dud. Definitely time to give up. If you tell me your shipping address I can send you a prepaid label and I can take that terrible pile of parts off of your hands... 😀

Kidding aside, getting started sometimes can be quite frustrating as there is some initial tweaking to be done to get everything dialed in, and become familiar with the operation of the printer as well.

If you bought it pre-built, I would advise reaching out to PR support through their website or via email. If it was a kit, you're left with forum "support" which is principally from other Mk2 users.

Either way, don't fret. Give yourself a day apart from it, and start at the top again. I would advise going through the first steps and calibration flow in the online manual carefully, and then if you still have difficulties, present them here and see if people can get you started in the right direction.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Yeah I think from the long experience on this forum, something is not right with your printer. Either you didn't assemble it correctly, or you've got a doa unit, which will happen since logistic companies are useless 90% of the times.

If you want help, you need to throw up some more info on the table.
Show us pictures of the v2 calibration failure, print a 20x20x20mm cube, send is pictures of that, especially the first layer.
Give us some data, what Z Live Adjust settings are you using right now? How do you clean your bed before printing?

If you just want to rant, good luck and sell me the printer! 😀

First step, stop trying 0.05mm as a layer height, it's pushing the printer to it's max and if you're not sure about that its correct assembled/calibrated, and you've managed to gather the knowledge needed to print that, don't bother. It wont make your prints look a lot better either.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Jason, one nasty question: did you buy the printer preassembled from filaments.ca?

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

First off I would like to appollagize to the group for my rant and to be honest I have been afraid to look at the replies because I felt I was being immature. However I finally got the courage to take a look today and thank you all who had positive replys and are trying to help.

I did get this as a kit yes from prusa directly. They have been quite helpful in figuring stuff out but I managed to do some more tests on my own. Calibration seems to go fine my axies are perfectly aligned. I do have a lot of trouble though with the z axis, just can't get v2calibration to stick 100%.

Ultimately I gave up on the included filament as well as a "cheap" brand I bought on amazon. I found one brand that works very well and although I am having some gap issues in my perimeter which I am trying to fix this brand sticks well. I increased the bed temp to 60 degrees though. The brand I am using is AMAZ3D.

I am hoping to figure out why I have gaps in my perimeter as well as my infill I have another post about this if anyone has any info.

Again thank you to everyone and I will try to keep my venting down to a minimum.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

First off I would like to appollagize to the group for my rant and to be honest I have been afraid to look at the replies because I felt I was being immature. However I finally got the courage to take a look today and thank you all who had positive replys and are trying to help.

I did get this as a kit yes from prusa directly. They have been quite helpful in figuring stuff out but I managed to do some more tests on my own. Calibration seems to go fine my axies are perfectly aligned. I do have a lot of trouble though with the z axis, just can't get v2calibration to stick 100%.

Ultimately I gave up on the included filament as well as a "cheap" brand I bought on amazon. I found one brand that works very well and although I am having some gap issues in my perimeter which I am trying to fix this brand sticks well. I increased the bed temp to 60 degrees though. The brand I am using is AMAZ3D.

I am hoping to figure out why I have gaps in my perimeter as well as my infill I have another post about this if anyone has any info.

Again thank you to everyone and I will try to keep my venting down to a minimum.

Sounds like you are having bed adhesion issues. I strongly recommend you clean the bed with 90%+ Isopropyl Alcohol and a little elbow grease. Coffee Filters are a good lint free cloth that are disposable (I use the flat folded kind). I know someone else in the Prusa MK2 Google Hangout tends to use micro fiber cloths. He was having adhesion issues as well until he switched to coffee filters. I know of no one that likes lint in their coffee. Now his adhesion problems are gone.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

If you can, show us some shots of what you are ending up with on your prints. You say the higher end layer heights are working but the fine is not? By chance did you change nozzles to do the fine prints?

I know they might seem like alot of questions but little details can help alot too. Fun crowd here and I'm sure they've all had their share of frustration at one time or another so don't worry about it. 🙂

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Sounds like you are having bed adhesion issues. I strongly recommend you clean the bed with 90%+ Isopropyl Alcohol and a little elbow grease. Coffee Filters are a good lint free cloth that are disposable (I use the flat folded kind). I know someone else in the Prusa MK2 Google Hangout tends to use micro fiber cloths. He was having adhesion issues as well until he switched to coffee filters. I know of no one that likes lint in their coffee. Now his adhesion problems are gone.

I have been using 90% Iso - but I never considered using filters (I have been using pieces of J-Cloth), as far as elbow grease - perhaps I am just being too gentle? My main problem is just getting things to stick (either first layer is a bust or print breaks free half way though). I will give the coffee filters a try.

One other question for experienced users. I purchases some plastic airtight containers to store filament (with some added silica gel packs). I use this for long term storage however do you guys always store your filament (even overnight) or do you leave a spool on the printer?

The strange thing is the printer was working well when I first put it together but after a few days I started having issues. Turns out it was the connector for the thermal sensor in the nozzle, once connected more securely things improved but not too the level it once was. I also swapped out the print bed for a new one (don't ask, let's just say I learned a painful lesson on how to pay attention during calibration).

Thanks to everyone for the help.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

If you can, show us some shots of what you are ending up with on your prints. You say the higher end layer heights are working but the fine is not? By chance did you change nozzles to do the fine prints?

I know they might seem like alot of questions but little details can help alot too. Fun crowd here and I'm sure they've all had their share of frustration at one time or another so don't worry about it. 🙂

Thank you. I can send some shots once I try again. (I tossed all the failed prints). Higher layer heights work very well (.35) .20 to .10 is hit or miss. .05 is almost always a failure. I have only printed one thing successfully (it was the tree frog, I printed with a grey AMAZ3D filament and it worked perfectly the very first time, I thought it would be my good luck frog so I brought him to work to show my co-workers, they were all impressed. However the next day 75% of the people I work with lost their jobs - 9 people out of 12, only I and 2 other people were saved. I thought that perhaps he was an evil frog and I have been trying to print him a friend for days - I didn't want to print using the grey filament again for fear of creating a new evil frog. I wanted to print a orange one, it's the MK2's colour so how could that be evil - but nothing will print out). I also tried a black filament (different brand) but it too will not print this file.

I assumed that some filaments don't support the finer setting. Is that true?

Anyway I was also trying to print other samples but nothing was working. I have not printed anything successfully with the orange (Prusa) filament other than the sample logo file.

Anyway... I smashed the grey frog the other day, if I could not print him a friend to counterbalance his evilness, it was the only other option.

My friends are still fired though. 😥

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

It can be very frustrating when things don't go right and you end up with a mess of spaghetti instead. I'm new to printing but have learned quite a lot the past couple of weeks while getting mine up and running.

One thing I have noticed initially, it was very difficult to get things to stick to the build plate, and things would move and the machine would go into spaghetti mode. I cleaned a few times with isopropyl alcohol and gave it some elbow grease using a paper towel, to make sure it was super clean. This helped and prints began to stick.

Thanks Sarah,

Others have mentioned this elbow grease concept. I will give it a more vigorous scrub. I will also check out the calibration link you posted.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Jason, what slicer are you using. I noticed in your latest post in this thread you mentioned higher layer heights have worked ok, but when printing layer heights under .20 you have issues with bed adhesion. I did notice on mine since it won't go lower than .15 for the first layer if I am printing something with a .1 or .05 layer height I have to compensate for this by setting a higher first layer height. I use Simplify3d and set the first layer height to 200% or 300% to compensate for this.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Try printing with a raft. And see how that goes.

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Grrr... just finished a long reply and I got a 500 error when I submitted...

Short version:

Elbow grease + coffee filters + 99% iso, better but test print still came loose after about 3mm (in height) of printing.

I am thinking I will reslice this file myself and adjust some settings (I am using the tree frog sample file that shipped with the printer)

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

I often use a 5mm brim to ensure corners don't peel up.

And/or you could do a live Z adjust and just lower the head a tiny bit?

Re: About ready to toss this thing...

Grrr... just finished a long reply and I got a 500 error when I submitted...

Short version:

Elbow grease + coffee filters + 99% iso, better but test print still came loose after about 3mm (in height) of printing.

I am thinking I will reslice this file myself and adjust some settings (I am using the tree frog sample file that shipped with the printer)

Forget 'elbow grease', it is pretty much impossible for PLA not to stick to relatively clean PEI bed.

The only secret here is to get Z offset right - first layer has to be thin and squished, very close to the bed. Unless your bed is covered with oil and gunk, even the direst PLA will stick to it in such case.

This might sound stupid, but when doing live Z offset adjustment make sure the offset value is negative ('-' on the display) - by moving knob clockwise, you are actually adding mm to the offset, which is making thing worse by moving the nozzle further away from the bed.