Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
Have been having failures printing with Fibrology PA6-CF20 on my new Core One. I've been printing PETG and some ASA successfully but haven't figured out what my issue is with this filament. All the failures seem to be the initial layer disconnecting from the print bed. Want to make sure my settings are correct and I'd only like to use an adhesive as a last resort.
Details:
- Textured print sheet
- 0.6mm Obxidian HF nozzle
- Filament has been dried and is being printed directly from a dry box with 10% RH
Attaching the .3mf and this dropbox link has the print file, filament profile, and photos of the issue: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/ozqmy83y77cxoh6xqwg2y/AFoYvghMe88yQrctmUXiZv0?rlkey=09aw5zitxl38q8pwp705ga0ze&dl=0
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
I have not tried this type of material myself yet. But I'm afraid that Prusa only recommends the textured or satin sheets with glue stick for all PA and PA6 filaments.
https://help.prusa3d.com/filament-material-guide
(Doesn't include your exact filament type, but lists Ultrafuse PA6 GF30 which probably has quite similar properties.)
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
Prusa's PEI based print sheets (satin, smooth, textured ) have poor adhesion to PA, needing adhesive to perform acceptably. Even using adhesive and a brim, large models will have trouble with warping, although CF/GF filled filaments are better than pure PA in this matter.
Some people uses third party garolite plates for printing PA with good results but, IMHO, the ultimate solution is a Prusa PA nylon powder coated sheet, which is specially dedicated to this purpose. Not cheap, but well worth the investment if you intend to print PA filaments on a regular basis.
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
IMHO, the ultimate solution is a Prusa PA nylon powder coated sheet, which is specially dedicated to this purpose. Not cheap, but well worth the investment if you intend to print PA filaments on a regular basis.
But tread carefully! If you check the material recommendation table I linked to above, you will see that Prusa recommends that special sheet only for specific PA-based filaments, and says it is a strict no-no (red X symbol) for others. Ultrafuse PA6 GF30, Ultrafuse PA and Filatech PA are out, for example. I have no idea why.
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
Ok, this is helpful. It sounds like the print surface is the issue and not the print settings. I'm going to try an adhesion promotor and report back. These materials are why I upgraded to the Core One from the Mk3 so I will look for a dedicated print sheet (currently out of stock).
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
I checked now and the Core One PA-nylon powder coated sheet is in stock.
As for the Ultrafuse and Filatech PA filaments being "forbidden" to use with the PA sheet, I wonder if Prusa has really tried them. Maybe they haven't. Another explanation (I'm just guessing ) is that they found out that the adhesion was too strong and large models were very difficult to remove afterwards.
Anyway, take with a few grains of salt Prusa's recommended settings. In my experience, sometimes they're quite wrong. For instance, they say that PETG prints well on the PA powder textured plate. Well, it doesn't at all ( I tried different PETG brands). Zero adhesion. Period.
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
I tried printing with this adhesive per a recommendation from a friend and this seems to have resolved the issue using the textured sheet: https://www.matterhackers.com/store/l/vision-miner-nano-polymer-adhesive/sk/MXNK0HK6
Thanks everyone for pointing me in the right direction!
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
I tried printing with this adhesive per a recommendation from a friend and this seems to have resolved the issue using the textured sheet: https://www.matterhackers.com/store/l/vision-miner-nano-polymer-adhesive/sk/MXNK0HK6
Thanks everyone for pointing me in the right direction!
I love that stuff… It is so easy to apply and it doesn’t gunk things up.
RE:
I have printed a few rolls of this filament in my core one. Bad news for you, that print sheet will never work -well- with this material.
It is a really nice filament, you will need to use:
PA sheet
PA glue (needs to be PA specific)
Brim
Out of the 3, brim might be optional depending on your design but it might pop off the plate at any given time.
This material suffers from tension as it cools down while printing and it is hard to keep on the plate. IF you keep all the 3 elements, you will print great.
Tune the filament too or I can share my profile (I use 0.4 nozzle).
Last, their PA612 filament prints very well with Prusa PA sheet. No brim needed and glue is optional but recommended. Much easier to work with than PA6, I do however like PA6 print quality a lot more.
I have used several rolls of both Fiberon filaments. Excellent by the way, and it will be very easy to print if you do what I suggested above.
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
Prusa advices against using any kind of glue on their PA steel plate. They claim isn't needed at all and it would damage the plate eventually. They also "forbid" to use solvents (acetone, IPA, etc ) to clean the plate, only pure water, maybe with a few drops of dish soap. We can't tell yet if they're over cautious about the glue/adhesive question, time will tell. Just in case, I follow carefully Prusa's instructions in this regard. This plate is too expensive to take any chances..
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
No issues with glue, have a few rolls with it through this plate. That reference is for their pa11 filament. Some formulations of PA need glue, there is no way around this some do not. Pa11 prusament and polymakers pa612 are two of them, poly pa6 is not and it needs glue. Use the glue with polymakers filament or it will not stick. Don't believe me, go ahead. Report back 🙂 The sheet is going to wear out eventually. Do yoi want to print or do you want to waste filament? Use the glue. Be happy. Life is short.
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
Another suggestion is Magigoo PA adhesive - it made a huge difference with the standard textured build sheet - and no issues with printing PETG right afterwards.
I also notice that I don't need to apply the Magigoo every time, it seems to "last" a couple of prints without issue.
I've been able to print very large, flat items that would have warped without this addition.
I have been also been iterating on extrusion multipliers, as it seems the stock PA settings have too large a multiplier - I've seen correct dimensional results with a 0.90 multiplier.
My biggest issue now is rough perimeters on the first layer - still tweaking that...
RE: Trouble printing Fiberon PA6-CF20
My new Prusa PA print sheet arrived and while the prints stick now, the quality is terrible. I tried the Prusament PA11 Carbon Fiber profile, and a custom one using the Fiberon settings and both are awful. The 3mfs are here and here.
I also tried printing a volumetric cube to see if the extrusion was the issue but it was so bad I don't even know where to start with it (3mf):
Can anyone share a 3mf with a known good print so I can try to get to a working base setting? I've read all the forum posts and no one seems to share their actual settings, only a description of them or how to get them. Clearly that hasn't worked for me!