Core One ASA issues
Hello,
I have a pre-assembled Core One with the latest firmware, a buddy camera, and a wiper nozzle setup. Last week, I started experimenting with ASA printing after primarily using PLA. I'm currently trying to print sections of a drybox for the side spool assembly area.
A couple of days ago, I ran into the dreaded spaghetti mess, which I initially thought was due to warping and layer lifting. I was using the Prusament ASA profile but have since adjusted it to maintain a minimum chamber temperature of 50-55°C, a bed temperature of 110°C, and either no fan or a fan speed of 0-10%. I always use a brim for better adhesion.
During my second attempt with these modified settings, everything was going smoothly until I noticed a louder sound when the extruder moved to the back wall of the enclosure. It printed well until it reached the same layer height as the first failed print. Suddenly, I heard squealing and grinding noises, and the extruder moved away from the print to the center, causing another spaghetti mess while printing in mid-air. When I stopped the print, the extruder home position emitted the same sounds.
I’m trying to troubleshoot the issue, unsure if I need to slow down the speeds or if something else is wrong.
When powered off, I can move the extruder back and forth without any issues or grinding. Even when powered on, I tested the control feature to move the extruder in the X/Y/Z directions, and everything seems fine.
Has anyone else experienced similar failures when printing with ASA? What’s the best way to resolve this issue?
I plan to run a calibration cube test and perhaps clean and re-lubricate the rails to see if that helps.
Thanks in advance for any assistance!
Last edited by geometry dash 3d a day ago
RE: Core One ASA issues
From the description it sounds your nozzle is hitting something in the model. Is there evidence of warping on the bottom layer? Also, you made a few changes to your settings, I hope one of them was to fix the insanity of the default to grid infill and instead use cubic or gyroid? Of course I can't be sure that's what's causing it but the default grid creates increasingly larger accumulations at the intersections of infill line until the nozzle hits them. But hey, it makes for faster prints, and being fast is all that counts, right? On that sour note, don't use any of the Fast profiles. I do a lot of ASA, and it's almost always the default Structural profile with infill changed to cubic.
Formerly known on this forum as @fuchsr -- https://foxrun3d.com/
RE: Core One ASA issues
ASA is has been an interesting filament to figure out for me too! I had a failed print with loud noises once. The part moved slightly and it went downhill in a hurry from there. I've tweaked the settings described by @FoxRun3D and prints have improved. I was not aware that Fast profiles are a no-no; need to makes ure not to select them.
Also, I realize this is just my opinion and opinions vary... I have not tried Prusament ASA but I have used Polymaker ASA as well as Overture ASA. In my setup, the Polymaker worked a bit better than the Overture. Again, this is my experience. But something to think about.
RE: Core One ASA issues
Polymaker ASA as well as Overture ASA
I was very much in the Overture camp for a long time (unless I splurged on Galaxy Black or PCCF Prusament) for most filament types, good quality at a reasonable price. More recently, I've become more and more converted to Polymaker. PLA, PETG, ASA, TPU, all print very nicely in my hands with standard PS profiles (sans grid infill, of course).
We live in wonderful times. Most filament brands today produce great outcome with little fuss. Can't even remember the last time I printed a temp tower.
Formerly known on this forum as @fuchsr -- https://foxrun3d.com/
RE: Core One ASA issues
I was very much in the Overture camp for a long time (unless I splurged on Galaxy Black or PCCF Prusament) for most filament types, good quality at a reasonable price. More recently, I've become more and more converted to Polymaker. PLA, PETG, ASA, TPU, all print very nicely in my hands with standard PS profiles (sans grid infill, of course).
My exact experience. I've purchased primarily Overture for a long time, but I've had great results with Polymaker PLA and ASA.
RE: Core One ASA issues
My experience on the CORE one for (Prusament) ASA has been faultless so far. No tweaks, just standard profiles and settings and all printed well.
RE: Core One ASA issues
My experience with ASA and PC Blend is that I get better control from warping using a rigid steel G10 build plate with Nano Polymer Adhesive, a 115° bed and a 60° chamber. The chamber temp is crucial. To get that I had to move the printer inside, cover top with insulation and disable the filtration fan. I can usually get the temp to approach 60°. There is a mod to install convection fans under the print bed. I'm thinking of giving this a try. What I really want is an official actively heated chamber.
RE:
Check whether the umbilical gets jammed against the X-axis motor. Temperature is as high as it gets, so the cable softens and sags.
You'll find that the spot next to the door handle (front right) is worst in terms of cold air circulation. It follows that the back left is the best spot - correct unless it provokes umbilical jamming.
"Fans off", yes. "Brim", also yes if print sheet contact area is significantly smaller than the actual print size. Or it'll warp.
I'm proud owner of and printing 10 spools of the cheapest and the 2nd-cheapest ASA, no issues with either (curiously, preferring the cheapest but different topic).
Speed, don't worry. You can crank up to "11" (well, make that "300 %" from the front panel, whatever - it stays always within machine limits). I've tried with a printer that has Loctite in the right places so I don't worry it'll fall apart. Watching gives a headache but it won't skip steps without running into an obstacle.
RE: Core One ASA issues
I've been spending an entire day tuning Prusament ASA for my diamondback nozzle. I'm still using a G10 sheet but the Nano Polymer Adhesive works too well as in I can't get the parts off the sheet. It's awesome for controlling warping though. Will try with a slightly lower bed temp and maybe no adhesive.
RE: Core One ASA issues
Hello,
[...]
________________________________________________________Last edited by [geometry dash 3d] a day ago
Now that's an interesting twist to link spamming: Masking your signature as a system message, and the link therein as a user name. I had not seen that trick before; will keep an eye out for it going forward.
At least this triggered an interesting discussion! But I have a feeling we won't see the OP again, at least not under this user name...
RE: Core One ASA issues
Oh, and the original post is of course not genuine. It was someone else's Reddit post, with minor re-wording probably done by AI: https://www.reddit.com/r/prusa3d/comments/1q97ldi/core_one_asa_issues/
RE: Core One ASA issues
Now that's an interesting twist to link spamming: Masking your signature as a system message
Wow. Just wow.
Formerly known on this forum as @fuchsr -- https://foxrun3d.com/
RE: Core One ASA issues
Didn't notice that. Interesting. Anyway, fun discussion non the less. Thomas Sanladerer had a new video out on (I'm paraphrasing) why the C1 sucks for printing engineering plastics that have a tendency to warp:
RE:
Do you realize that if you print for long periods of time with a chamber temperature of 60C you’re shortening considerably the lifespan of your printer ?.
Domestic printers like the Prusa Core One L or from other brands, aren’t really designed to work reliably in these conditions. You need industrials machines for that. On domestic printers, the electronic boards and the steppers will overheat and fail eventually, because none of these machines uses military grade components. Besides, 3D plastic printed parts will degrade faster (specially if made from PETG ); many lubes will become too liquid and leak from the rods or the linear rails, as in that video. Even the belts won’t like much working that hot.
It’s quite significant that the people from Voron Design won’t endorse heated beds mods from the users, They think it’s potentially dangerous (risk of fires, etc. ) unless the printer is a professional machine made from metal/glass/silicone, heat proof electronics and no plastic printed parts. Not the case with 99% of the domestic printers available on the market.
Do yourselves a favor and avoid going over 45-50C on the chamber. There’re more ways of fight warping other than just heat.
RE:
Do you realize that if you print for long periods of time with a chamber temperature of 60C you’re shortening considerably the lifespan of your printer ?.
Domestic printers like the Prusa Core One L or from other brands, aren’t really designed to work reliably in these conditions. You need industrials machines for that. On domestic printers, the electronic boards and the steppers will overheat and fail eventually, because none of these machines uses military grade components. Besides, 3D plastic printed parts will degrade faster (specially if made from PETG ); many lubes will become too liquid and leak from the rods or the linear rails, as in that video. Even the belts won’t like much working that hot.
It’s quite significant that the people from Voron Design won’t endorse heated beds mods from the users, They think it’s potentially dangerous (risk of fires, etc. ) unless the printer is a professional machine made from metal/glass/silicone, heat proof electronics and no plastic printed parts. Not the case with 99% of the domestic printers available on the market.
Do yourselves a favor and avoid going over 45-50C on the chamber. There’re more ways of fight warping other than just heat.
Because I don't care? If a part fails I'll get another one and if that doesn't work I'll just get another printer? All of the internal PETG in my printer was replaced with PC Blend. And are these actual stats from the field or just your guess? Perhaps Prusa should firmware limit the chamber to 50° then. As it is this printer is getting in my way. Twice I've almost bought a 22 IDEX but I just can't justify spending that kind of money on a hobby anymore.
And yes, changing infill, cooling and part placement can also control warping. I also prefer heat.
Anyway, once the INDX arrives, I'll buy a printer that can properly print engineering plastics.
RE:
To add to this, once the novelty of the INDX wears off and I need a decent enclosed chamber again, I'll probably just get a printer like the H2D to do the things the Core One can't.
RE:
I also watched the above video yesterday and wasn't surprised in the least that Prusa's nifty "solution" was simply a compromised shortcut for those actually trying to use these printers to their full spec. Similarly, although I appreciate how small the chamber is in the Core One, it is not a true answer to the absence of a chamber heater. There are significant variations to ambient temps, and one of the reasons why I love an enclosed core xy printer is to avoid having to wait for a seasonal change in order to print certain large parts. Once you have access to whatever chamber temps you want, no matter the ambient and bed temps, you immediately understand the value.
To be fair though, I don't think most people print much beyond PLA/PETG/TPU. Now that is changing, and will continue to change...but this is likely why Prusa hasn't felt the need to aggressively cater to those using engineering filaments.
However, the fact that they are positioned as a privacy friendly product, and many people in industry who value privacy also use engineering grade filaments, Prusa could be missing a true opportunity. It makes me wonder if they just haven't grasped the pace at which their competitors would be able to pivot into higher grade filament printing. Clearly the jump from 65c (standard for Bambu/Qidi/others) to 100c like the 22 IDEX is a costly one. However given the choice between a passively heated max 55~60c chamber and an actively heated 65c chamber for a similar cost, most will choose the 65c active. It wouldn't be surprising to me if some manufacturers aren't already developing 70-80c + printers for release in the next year or two. Interest is there, and doing so would meet the needs of companies either unable to use or simply hesitant about Bambu due to privacy. Qidi already has a cold air design for their new extruder, and I can easily imagine this could set them up nicely to further increase the chamber temps while avoiding cooling/clogging issues for higher temp materials. This development is moving very quickly.
It seems plausible for Qidi or Bambu to whip up a true competitor to the 22 Idex, and sell it for under 10K, which would pressure the HT90 as well. As it is, I suspect they already offer equal or better print quality than the 22Idex, and Qidi already has experience with IDEX.
Add a proper chamber heater to the Core One L, (and make sure the motors and circuitry aren't going to cook at 65c) and many people will stick with Prusa I think.
-J
RE: Core One ASA issues
Add a proper chamber heater to the Core One L, (and make sure the motors and circuitry aren't going to cook at 65c) and many people will stick with Prusa I think.
Combine this with INDX, and find a way to stretch the extruder temps to 340-350c...and they are still very much competitive. This is what surprises me most when they choose these half-solutions. Come out with a simple bolt on heater design and integrate its control into the Prusa app.
-J
RE:
However, the fact that they are positioned as a privacy friendly product, and many people in industry who value privacy also use engineering grade filaments, Prusa could be missing a true opportunity. It makes me wonder if they just haven't grasped the pace at which their competitors would be able to pivot into higher grade filament printing. Clearly the jump from 65c (standard for Bambu/Qidi/others) to 100c like the 22 IDEX is a costly one. It seems plausible for Qidi or Bambu to whip up a true competitor to the 22 Idex, and sell it for under 10K, which would pressure the HT90 as well. As it is, I suspect they already offer equal or better print quality than the 22Idex, and Qidi already has experience with IDEX.
Add a proper chamber heater to the Core One L, (and make sure the motors and circuitry aren't going to cook at 65c) and many people will stick with Prusa I think.
It's odd to me that Prusa developed a 400° hotend for the Core One but still doesn't have an active chamber heater mod. I read somewhere (I need to find it) that the LoveBoard is rated to 70C (or maybe I imagined it). Anyway, the H2* and Qidi printers advertise 65° chambers. Maybe you are right @Artur5, I'm abusing the printer and it's going to eventually going to shut down on me. I'll probably keep it around for fun if that happens and get a serious printer to replace it.
ASA aside, polycarbonate requires an evenly heated bed and a hot chamber (55+) for large parts and no amount of infill or perimeter tweaking is going to get around this requirement. So indeed, the Core One is getting in the way.
RE: Core One ASA issues
...none of these machines uses military grade components.
... couldn't resist ...
OK, military grade components for them folks who print engineering material with need for privacy.
Ordinary Joes check "industrial" or "automotive" (generally implying wider temperature range) but there is e.g. no need for expensive burn-in processes.
If my printer fails, it fails, so what. Just don't put it into pacemakers or thermonuclear missiles 🙂