1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl  

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

but if you print on a vinyl record, will it copy it? 🙂

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

but if you print on a vinyl record, will it copy it? 🙂
Yeah, but Sony's lawyers would show up.

Here's another test with a pebbled surface texture from another vinyl manufacturer. Again, good adhesion:

And a very clean 1st layer result:

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

Very interesting!
Is this vinyl self-adhesive or have you glued it to the steel plate?

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

[...] Is this vinyl self-adhesive or have you glued it to the steel plate?

It's the self-adhesive car wrap stuff.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

There is a post on the prusa facebook page from someone using a carbon fiber weave texture vinyl wrap to have that look on the bottom of his prints . I am amazed that they stand up to the heat but a bit of thought and the inside dash of a black car on a hot summer day can get well over 100c and the wrp materials need to tolerate that

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

There is a post on the prusa facebook page from someone using a carbon fiber weave texture vinyl wrap to have that look on the bottom of his prints . That may be the same person that posted to reddit. I'm not a fan of the CF weave patterns, but they offer textured vinyl in a variety of textures. I've got pebbled and the hex pattern mounted, and brushed aluminum is next. There's also a concrete surface texture that looks very interesting, but I can only find expensive rolls of the stuff.

I am amazed that they stand up to the heat but a bit of thought and the inside dash of a black car on a hot summer day can get well over 100c and the wrp materials need to tolerate thatThat's my thinking as well. I'm using them for PLA at around 60C. No bad smells, but I'd like to find something definitive that indicates they're not toxic indoors.

Here's another quick surface test using larger surfaces. I'm still working on the Live-Z calibration, as it seems more touchy with these patterns. Unfortunately, I wasn't very skilled at applying the textured surface, so you can see a few bubbles and some lint that accumulated.

The big pleasant surprise for me so far has been how good adhesion is. The stuff seems to grip when heated, yet parts pop off easily afterwards. I'm going to do a sequence of prints in the same spot to see how well it holds up, but for now, if I need a unique texture, there's an option available.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing. Please keep us posted.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

Interesting. So you are heating it to 60c? Have you IR'd the surface to see what it really is sitting at?

As for VOC's - I doubt anyone in the aftermarket industry worries about it nor has any data. In a car the temps can approach 150f, or 65c, I'd guess the glues are probably good for extended use at 60c. You could try using a particle meter near the plate as it heats, watch for any increase in PM2.5 (PM1 if you have it). Also, some of the cheapo meters have an organic sensor ...

Now I know what to do with my 'used' PEI sheets. Can you link to the sand blast texture you purchased?

All I could find on 3M's film product.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

Interesting. So you are heating it to 60c? Have you IR'd the surface to see what it really is sitting at?Not yet. I'm sure it's a bit cooler due to having put another material on the flip side. Results have been very good, and I'm happy to keep temps down if possible. I'm going to try going lower to test the limits. So far, with a few prints on each side, adhesion remains good.

As for VOC's - I doubt anyone in the aftermarket industry worries about it nor has any data. In a car the temps can approach 150f, or 65c, I'd guess the glues are probably good for extended use at 60c. You could try using a particle meter near the plate as it heats, watch for any increase in PM2.5 (PM1 if you have it). Also, some of the cheapo meters have an organic sensor ...I don't want to spend too much, but I would like to pick up such a meter eventually. Can you recommend any?

Edit: Found this one. Any idea if that is worthwhile?

Now I know what to do with my 'used' PEI sheets. Can you link to the sand blast texture you purchased?
The best deal seems to be sample sizes. Here are the ones I've got so far:

I've got the honeycomb and brush aluminum textures so far. Will try to mount and test the aluminum soon. Things I want to try:

Lesson learned: Pick a color that you don't print in often. Calibrating Live-Z with a bed the same color as your filament is tough.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

I wonder if car shops that do this might be a source of these types of vinyl sheet in small sizes. I'm sure they have off-cuts. But you might be limited in variety based on what they have recently used.

If you live near a shop that does this it might be worth it to stop by in person and ask.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

I wonder if car shops that do this might be a source of these types of vinyl sheet in small sizes. I'm sure they have off-cuts. But you might be limited in variety based on what they have recently used.
I used samples of the vinyl used for cars in 12x12in sample sizes. Found them for $3 apiece with fast shipping. No car shops nearby where I live, but it would be nice to be able to see what's available in textures.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

A quick follow up with more results. Unfortunately, I mis-judged the 1st layer for some of the prints, so there's a bit of under-extrusion causing the printer lines to overwhelm the textures a bit.

My poor "lab rat" Prusa smooth PEI surface:

Fake BuildTak surface for comparison:

Pebble-textured vinyl in black:

And silver-gray:

"Matrix" textured vinyl:

Brushed aluminum textured vinyl:

General summary based on experience so far:

After trashing a couple of my vinyl samples, I'm going to stick with cold bed printing techniques. I think PETG may be possible with a warm (55-65C) bed and some MagiGoo, but I won't be able to try this for a few days.

Quick shot of the film removal process:

The generic stuff comes off very easily. The thinner 3M film requires a bit of heat to coax it off, but does come off cleanly. No limonene, no acetone to deal with!

Improved with nGen! 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

In our relentless pursuit of solutions to the problems nobody has, Muppet Labs has been working on getting PETG and nGen to print on the textured vinyl. I've had some luck with my "coldbrew" configuration using a 40C bed with a good slather of glue stick (MagiGoo sadly requires more heat) using Colorfabb nGen.

So far, PETG seems to print just a bit too hot (230 v 220C) to get it to release without destroying the vinyl.

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

"In our relentless pursuit of solutions to the problems nobody has"
isn't that what professor honeydew did?

science is fun 🙂

Re: 1st layer texture - Surprising results printing on textured vinyl

"In our relentless pursuit of solutions to the problems nobody has"

Most science in a nutshell... I recall reading about someone that did a study on the palatability of tadpoles. Because we clearly need to commit more frog infanticide in the quest to put food on the table... 😆