Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
For about 5 months I've had my Prusa i3 MK3 running perfectly fine. Installing the MMU2 was rough but I've got it sort out. However, there's one problem that plagues my multimaterial prints.
I have been able to set a near perfect first layer at around -.98 or -.99 mm. Anything I print (anywhere) has a perfect first layer and 99.9% of it is still touching the print bed after the print with PLA. The first layer or two of the wipe tower looks alright too. However, if the first couple layers of the wipe tower are mostly hollow (e.g. when there is no need to change color for a while) the wipe tower quickly starts to lift off the print bed. Most of my prints where this happens I have to cancel as the tower completely slips off the print bed and causes spaghetti. This almost NEVER happens when the first couple layers of the tower are solid.
I have narrowed this issue to a couple possibilities. One would be the fact that since only one solid layer of plastic is touching the print bed, it has a tendency to be flexible and peel up with almost no resistance. Another would be the hot air. Since the cooling fan is usually over that part of the build, the semi-hollow structure would create air pockets that would rather warp the plastic from cooling too fast or physically blow up the bottom layer and push up away from the print bed.
Because of this, and the fact that I can't find a setting (besides rafts, which I don't need for the actual model that can do this, I am suggesting that there should be a way to let users set the number of solid layers for a wipe tower, no matter if color change is needed or not. It's sort of like the "enforce support for X layers" feature, but for the wipe tower. This way, the chance of causing warping from filament will go down.
I'm not sure if this is already implemented and I just can't find it (I've looked in the 1.41.2 and 1.42.0-alpha2 versions and found nothing. I hope that maybe some day someone will develop this feature, as it is much needed!
Thank you for your time!
Mathieu 🙂
Hi! I'm Mathieu!
Thingiverse: https://www.thingiverse.com/BramForReal/about
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCh-2bXtfv-nLwgwO7H7IJxA
I have an Original Prusa i3 MK3 with MMU 2.0. Nice meeting ya! 😀
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
Did you ever find a workaround?
Prusa MK2s -> MK2.5 -> MK2.5 MMU2
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
My suggestion for action is to clean the bed thoroughly.
Not with isopropanol or other alcohol.
Not with Acetone.
Use detergent and water, it does wonders when the filament does not stick as it should.
Bear MK3 with Bondtech extruder
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
- - -
Use detergent and water, it does wonders when the filament does not stick as it should.
Please use dishwashing soap with warm water - DO NOT use detergent.
Bill
Tagaytay City, Philippines
Founder member of Philippines Prusa Printer Owners FB Group
Sponsor Pillars of God Academy in Bacoor
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
are they different words for different countries?
What is dish soap called in the UK?
dish soap noun [ U ] uk /ˈdɪʃ ˌsəʊp/ us /ˈdɪʃ ˌsoʊp/ US US also dish detergent, UK washing-up liquid. a thick liquid detergent, added to hot water when washing pans, knives and forks, etc. Cleaning agents. abrasive.
maybe it's the same stuff?
Joan
I try to make safe suggestions,You should understand the context and ensure you are happy that they are safe before attempting to apply my suggestions, what you do, is YOUR responsibility. Location Halifax UK
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
Soap is made from natural substances whilst detergents are purely chemical. I have always thought of soap as a gentler alternative and detergents are harsher and more industrialised.
Since you asked, I did look for confirmation and was led to this article https://www.differencebetween.com/difference-between-soap-and-vs-detergents/
This seems to support that soaps are better suited to skin contact and manual application, but many other results show that the original meaning of detergent is becoming lost and the word is now frequently interchanged/used where soap is the more appropriate term. Unfortunately there is a marked global trend toward the use of more imprecise language that makes accurate communication impossible.
I looked for information on reaction between PEI and soaps/detergents, but found nothing useful though it was interesting to see that PEI is an ingredient in several common laundry detergents.
So after all that rambling I am led to the conclusion that Prusa intention is inconclusive.
Bill
Tagaytay City, Philippines
Founder member of Philippines Prusa Printer Owners FB Group
Sponsor Pillars of God Academy in Bacoor
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
I've seen Dawn or its international equivalents -- the stuff with the baby ducks in the ads -- specifically called out, as some dish soaps use anti-bacterial, skin conditioning, anti-spotting or other "enhancements" that can be problematic for adhesion. Fortunately, there are some good summaries of those brands for non-US users. Fairy is the name I see cited for the UK.
[...] Please use dishwashing soap with warm water - DO NOT use detergent.
and miscellaneous other tech projects
He is intelligent, but not experienced. His pattern indicates two dimensional thinking. -- Spock in Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
I have the a much higher success ratio when printing round objects instead of squares. It seems like the warping stress is concentrated in the sharp corners and it is more likely to lift. Round objects almost never lift.
Is there any way to get the slicer to create a circular wipe tower instead of a square?
Steve
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
Is there any way to get the slicer to create a circular wipe tower instead of a square?
Nice idea. The purge volume calculation would need to be adjusted but besides of that t should stay straight forward. A selection of preferred tower shape would be great enhancement to Slic3r.
You could kind of bypass this issue by creating a tube in a required size and purge into this object.
Often linked posts:
Going small with MMU2
Real Multi Material
My prints on Instagram
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
Is there any way to get the slicer to create a circular wipe tower instead of a square?
Nice idea. The purge volume calculation would need to be adjusted but besides of that t should stay straight forward. A selection of preferred tower shape would be great enhancement to Slic3r.
You could kind of bypass this issue by creating a tube in a required size and purge into this object.
It would not be "ideal". Especially with regards to the ramming, which does require a more constant extrude and that would not happen at the start of a layer. (KISS uses an octagonal purge tower and alternates direction with each layer which helps 🙂 )
Peter
Please note: I do not have any affiliation with Prusa Research. Any advices given are offered in good faith. It is your responsibility to ensure that by following my advice you do not suffer or cause injury, damage…
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
It would not be "ideal". Especially with regards to the ramming, which does require a more constant extrude and that would not happen at the start of a layer.
The shape of the object doesn't define extrusion (width/speed/volume). You can use any kind of shape for the purge block and do the same ramming/purging/cooling... It's more or less the same approach like using your print objects as waste tower.
Often linked posts:
Going small with MMU2
Real Multi Material
My prints on Instagram
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
Is there any way to get the slicer to create a circular wipe tower instead of a square?
Nice idea. The purge volume calculation would need to be adjusted but besides of that t should stay straight forward. A selection of preferred tower shape would be great enhancement to Slic3r.
You could kind of bypass this issue by creating a tube in a required size and purge into this object.
It would not be "ideal". Especially with regards to the ramming, which does require a more constant extrude and that would not happen at the start of a layer. (KISS uses an octagonal purge tower and alternates direction with each layer which helps 🙂 )
Peter
An octagon should have almost the same benefit as a circle and is a huge improvement over a rectangle. This seems like a good choice.
Steve
Re: Slic3r PE "anti-warping" suggestion
An octagon should have almost the same benefit as a circle and is a huge improvement over a rectangle. This seems like a good choice.
Well, I have never had an octagonal purge tower lifting off the bed.
The shape of the object doesn't define extrusion (width/speed/volume).
When ramming (not purging), you need a constantly high speed to get the best results. The first tool change of every layer would only have a very short extrusion, a stop, reverse, short extrusion, stop, reverse, etc. And calculations are hard enough with just 8 sides 😉
Peter
Please note: I do not have any affiliation with Prusa Research. Any advices given are offered in good faith. It is your responsibility to ensure that by following my advice you do not suffer or cause injury, damage…