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One printer slower than another?  

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buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
One printer slower than another?

I have three MK3S+ printers, having just assembled the third one about a week ago.  I have noticed that the new third printer takes about 20% longer to print the exact same model as the other two printers.  The third printer was setup in PrusaSlicer by simply copying another printer.

As far as I know there are only two differences:
1.  The third printer uses the new super pinda, the first two use the older standard pinda.
2.  I use Octoprint and the only software difference is a different IP address for Octopi.

Any idea why the third printer prints slower?

Also, I'm getting a lot of Y-axis crash detections.  I've checked the belt tension and the other things in the support article but everything looks good.  I turned off crash detection for the time being.

Posted : 26/05/2021 1:43 pm
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?

Actually now that I think about it, the third printer didn't start out printing slower than the others.  It might have started when I turned off crash detection.

Posted : 26/05/2021 1:51 pm
Diem
 Diem
(@diem)
Famed Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

First, with the power off, move the Y axis by hand; is is smooth? Does the resistance stay the same over the whole range?

Clean and lubricate the smooth rods, check they are not damaged/scratched. Check the idler pulley is not clogged, out of line, or damaged (loosen the belt and try turning it with your fingertip, is it smooth?)

With the belt loose try turning the stepper motor by hand; is is smooth?

Retighten the belt until it just begins to make a low musical note when plucked...

If the printer works, make your next print this:

https://www.prusaprinters.org/prints/46639-tension-meter-for-the-gt2-belts-of-i3-mk3s-or-prus

It MUST be printed in Prusament PETG or the spring tension will be wrong.

Let us know how you get on.

Cheerio,

Posted : 26/05/2021 2:45 pm
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?
Posted by: @diem

First, with the power off, move the Y axis by hand; is is smooth? Does the resistance stay the same over the whole range?  The bed moves smoothly over the whole range.

Clean and lubricate the smooth rods, check they are not damaged/scratched. Check the idler pulley is not clogged, out of line, or damaged (loosen the belt and try turning it with your fingertip, is it smooth?)  I cleaned the bearings and replaced with Superlube.  The smooth rods are smooth (no bearing grooves etc).  Belt, idler pulley and motor all turn smoothly.  

With the belt loose try turning the stepper motor by hand; is is smooth?

Retighten the belt until it just begins to make a low musical note when plucked...I think the belt might have been a little tight so I loosened it a bit to see how that works.  

If the printer works, make your next print this:

https://www.prusaprinters.org/prints/46639-tension-meter-for-the-gt2-belts-of-i3-mk3s-or-prus

It MUST be printed in Prusament PETG or the spring tension will be wrong.  I do not have any Prusament PETG.  Is it worth trying with another PETG brand?

Let us know how you get on.

Cheerio,

Thanks for the reply.  See responses above.  In addition to that, I should have mentioned that prints come out great so there's no problem there.  Your post deals with the Y-axis crash detection but I'm more concerned with why the printer is taking longer to print.  

Posted : 26/05/2021 5:14 pm
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(@)
Illustrious Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

@buckeyestargazer

The steppers are under the control of the stepper drivers. All clock controlled. Only if one Einsy has a higher clock rate would one printer be slower than another. The crystals controlling the Einsy clocks are generally within a fraction of a percent - not generally human detectable. 

So it is most likely a settings thing. If you really want to figure out what's been changed (or at least verify is it a setting) -- do a full reset with data clear on both printers and redo all the calibrations to ensure all of the user settings are reset to factory and you are comparing both printers from the same point. Or get out a scope and check the two clocks, make sure they really are both running 16Mhz as designed. Though - I'd expect you'd be having other print issues beyond simple time to print.

 

Posted : 26/05/2021 7:11 pm
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Noble Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

@buckeyestargazer

"is it worth printing in another PETG" - no, not if you want it to be a useful tool.  the GCODE is tuned to Prusament PETG for giving an accurate read.  If you don't have some, see if you can borrow some.  If you can't borrow some use the map to see if someone near you can print it for you.  Otherwise think about print for hire.  Depending on where you live, the mail costs of getting it to you will either be cheap or not, depending on your location or origin.  Or, buy a roll.

Posted : 26/05/2021 9:29 pm
Diem
 Diem
(@diem)
Famed Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

I do not have any Prusament PETG.  Is it worth trying with another PETG brand?

No, the part is tuned to Prusament's stiffness.

Your post deals with the Y-axis crash detection but I'm more concerned with why the printer is taking longer to print.

If the printer is stopping to reset after crashes prints will take longer...

Print speeds are configurable.

Cheerio,

Posted : 26/05/2021 10:42 pm
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?
Posted by: @diem

I do not have any Prusament PETG.  Is it worth trying with another PETG brand?

No, the part is tuned to Prusament's stiffness.

Your post deals with the Y-axis crash detection but I'm more concerned with why the printer is taking longer to print.

If the printer is stopping to reset after crashes prints will take longer...

Print speeds are configurable.

Cheerio,

Crash detection is turned off and is not stopping mid print.  

Posted : 26/05/2021 10:48 pm
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(@)
Illustrious Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

@buckeyestargazer

It may not be stopping the print, but it is ruining the print. Sort or like taking the batteries out of your smoke alarm because it's too noisy.

Posted : 27/05/2021 1:37 am
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?

I did a complete factory reset and went through the calibration wizard again.  The first print completed in the expected time it should have.  Assuming that stays the case, resetting the printer seems to have fixed that issue.  

I still had 1 Y-axis crash detection on this print.  Although moving the Y axis build plate by hand was smooth in the sense that I didn't feel much resistance and it was consistent from front to back, I wonder if I tightened the bearing clips too tight.  It feels slightly "gravel-ly" when pushing the build plate, but it feels the same as my other printers too.  I assumed that was the motor resistance.  Perhaps I'll take the belt off the motor and see how the bed feels. 

Posted : 27/05/2021 3:19 am
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(@)
Illustrious Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

@buckeyestargazer

Curious if you cleaned and packed the linear bushings before installation?

Posted : 27/05/2021 5:42 am
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?
Posted by: @tim-2

@buckeyestargazer

Curious if you cleaned and packed the linear bushings before installation?

Yes, I did.  Packed with Superlube.  

Posted : 27/05/2021 11:52 am
Swiss_Cheese
(@swiss_cheese)
Noble Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

Did you happen to look at the lcd and see if its running at 100%

 

 

or something lower?

The Filament Whisperer

Posted : 28/05/2021 6:19 am
Peter M
(@peter-m)
Noble Member
RE: One printer slower than another?

Bearing with the old way to , if you tighten to hard, the bed sliding will get bad, because you can deform the bearings.

The new clips , the new way, I tightened the clips all the way, just rebuild my bearings.

Try loosening the belt a little, under and on top of , front belt holder under the LCD screen , you could try loosening the bolts a little(2 bolts, then test with a not as tight belt.

Posted : 28/05/2021 6:55 am
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?
Posted by: @peter-m

Bearing with the old way to , if you tighten to hard, the bed sliding will get bad, because you can deform the bearings.

The new clips , the new way, I tightened the clips all the way, just rebuild my bearings.

Try loosening the belt a little, under and on top of , front belt holder under the LCD screen , you could try loosening the bolts a little(2 bolts, then test with a not as tight belt.

This printer uses the new bearing clips (not the old U-bolts).  I actually already tried loosening the belt, but the self check threw an error and said to check for a loose Y-axis motor.  After tightening the belt back up again the self check completed successfully.  

Posted : 28/05/2021 12:40 pm
buckeyestargazer
(@buckeyestargazer)
Estimable Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: One printer slower than another?
Posted by: @swiss_cheese

Did you happen to look at the lcd and see if its running at 100%

 

 

or something lower?

After the factory reset it says100%.  I do not know what it was before the reset.  
I do know that before the reset there was a "?" behind the countdown print timer, and the timer was way off.  After the reset the countdown timer is accurate again without the "?".  So something was up with the software that the reset fixed.  

Posted : 28/05/2021 12:43 pm
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