First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help
 
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Todd Martineau
(@todd-martineau)
Active Member
First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

Prusa MK3S, smooth sheet, Firmware 3.9.2-3524, I have been printing tons of stuff for about a year on textured and smooth sheets.

Printing with 3D Solutech White filament.

Problem description: 1st layer thinner than expected and curls off the sheet sometimes. See photos in this Google photos album

https://photos.app.goo.gl/ke9LYHG5iaCMiNqz9

 

What I have tried to fix it:

Cleaned plate with Dawn dish soap and plenty of warm water. Dried with clean paper towel.

Tried switch to Hatchbox white filament. No improvement.

Cleaned bed with Acetone and the 91% Isopropyl alcohol.

Ran self test.

Leveled bed manually using Octoprint 'Prusa Leveling Guide' plugin. Got 0.015 bed variance.

Checked tension of idler. It is good.

Ran the calibration wizard: Self test passed, XYZ calibration was ok, x/y axes were perpendicular, set the Z height using the built in z height calibration.

Ran the Live Z My Way 75x75 for PLA z height calibration test. Happy with the results. I usually set the squish enough to eliminate intersection holes but not so much that there are rough surface waves. 

Recleaned the surface with 91% isopropyl alcohol.

Tried to print but in places where the printer is just starting to put down material the filament curls up off the plate a little. Also the extrusion width seems thinner than what I expect; it doesn't seem to match the width of my Live Z Adjust My Way test.

I feel like not enough filament is coming out of the extruder and it isn't being squished enough. 

My printing has ground to a stop. 

I can easily print on my textured sheet with PETG. But I can't print with PLA on my smooth sheet. 

Any ideas?

Posted : 26/12/2020 4:34 pm
JoanTabb
(@joantabb)
Moderator
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

Hi Todd, 

have you considered washing your build plate in order to try and restore adhesion? 

Just wash the build plate with hot water and a touch of Dish soap, rubbing well with a clean kitchen sponge, Rinsing well with Hot Water and drying immediately with plain paper towels,  do not touch the build surface after cleaning, 
I do not use IPA, or any other surface treatment for Printing PLA on Smooth PEI.  as your process isn't currently working, Please try without IPA

I use 7X7 Mesh bed levelling that tests 49 points on the build plate instead of the 3x3 which only tests 9 points on the build plate

and I use 70C on the Build plate for PLA. 

You could consider using a 0.3mm first layer and  increasing the first layer extrusion width to say 1.5 times the nozzle width!

regards Joan 

I try to make safe suggestions,You should understand the context and ensure you are happy that they are safe before attempting to apply my suggestions, what you do, is YOUR responsibility. Location Halifax UK

Posted : 26/12/2020 5:47 pm
Peter M
(@peter-m)
Noble Member
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

Check if your nozzle has a  clog. Move extruder higher, and extrude and look if filament is not to thin or curling to much. And do a high temperature extrude to get all petg out of nozzle, yes extrude pla with a higher temp . Do a cold pull to clean the nozzle, prusa has a manual for this, needs to be done with pla.

Clean bed with dish soap only, this is the best way, after this you can test print.

Your picture I can not see!

Bed temperature 10 higher will help.

The pei sheet, try a little higher(or a lot higher) and lower in small steps, print a big flat square so you have time to adjust.

The difference between pei and powder coated , the powder coated needs to go lower, this setting is for the pei sheet to low and the filament will come loose because you are to low.(I am not talking about the height difference from the plates).

 

Posted : 27/12/2020 7:25 am
MrBleadd
(@mrbleadd)
Active Member
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

I have the same Problem

The day before I did the Firmware update, everything worked perfectly. Since I flashed the printer with the new Firmware, I can't even print the first-Layer calibration. It always lifts at the corners, it doesn't matter how I adjust it.

I cleaned all my build plates with 91% Isopropyl alcohol.

washing the build plates

Ran self-test

Ran the calibration wizard: Self-test passed, XYZ calibration was ok, x/y axes were perpendicular, set the Z height using the built-in z height calibration.

Checked if the nozzle was clogged(wasn't clogged), even replaced it with a new one 

I always use 7x7 Mesh bed levelling

I tried to print with other PLA Spools, but always the same result

The only thing that I haven't tried is 70C Bedtemp. and using a 0.3mm first layer and increasing the first layer extrusion width to say 1.5 times the nozzle width. If this also doesn't work, I try to go back to the older Firmware.

 

Posted : 27/12/2020 5:06 pm
MrBleadd
(@mrbleadd)
Active Member
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

Okay, today I tried the other recommendations, but they also did not work, so I switched back to the older Firmware fw_3_9_1 and the printer works again. Perfect Adhesion to the Bed. I will stick with the older version for now. 

Posted : 28/12/2020 8:37 am
Todd Martineau
(@todd-martineau)
Active Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

Mrbleadd: thank you for your suggestion about the firmware. Now that I think of it it does seem like my problem started as soon as I updated the firmware. I will try the older firmware and see if it helps. 

I have tried all of the above suggestions like a million times. I've cleaned that smooth sheet...SOOOO clean. I replaced the nozzle yesterday with an E3D stock nozzle; didn't help. 

I'm going to try the firmware update....please please work. I need my printer back!

Posted : 01/01/2021 6:30 pm
MrBleadd
(@mrbleadd)
Active Member
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help

@todd-martineau

I hope that works for you and you can start printing again. ^-^

Posted : 01/01/2021 8:17 pm
dimprov
(@dimprov)
Noble Member
RE: First layer problems...I'm struggling so bad...I need your help
Posted by: @todd-martineau

Prusa MK3S, smooth sheet, Firmware 3.9.2-3524, I have been printing tons of stuff for about a year on textured and smooth sheets.

Printing with 3D Solutech White filament.

Problem description: 1st layer thinner than expected and curls off the sheet sometimes. See photos in this Google photos album

https://photos.app.goo.gl/ke9LYHG5iaCMiNqz9

 

What I have tried to fix it:

Cleaned plate with Dawn dish soap and plenty of warm water. Dried with clean paper towel.

Tried switch to Hatchbox white filament. No improvement.

Cleaned bed with Acetone and the 91% Isopropyl alcohol.

Ran self test.

Leveled bed manually using Octoprint 'Prusa Leveling Guide' plugin. Got 0.015 bed variance.

Checked tension of idler. It is good.

Ran the calibration wizard: Self test passed, XYZ calibration was ok, x/y axes were perpendicular, set the Z height using the built in z height calibration.

Ran the Live Z My Way 75x75 for PLA z height calibration test. Happy with the results. I usually set the squish enough to eliminate intersection holes but not so much that there are rough surface waves. 

Recleaned the surface with 91% isopropyl alcohol.

Tried to print but in places where the printer is just starting to put down material the filament curls up off the plate a little. Also the extrusion width seems thinner than what I expect; it doesn't seem to match the width of my Live Z Adjust My Way test.

I feel like not enough filament is coming out of the extruder and it isn't being squished enough. 

My printing has ground to a stop. 

I can easily print on my textured sheet with PETG. But I can't print with PLA on my smooth sheet. 

Any ideas?

That's an impressive collection of photos.  Pardon my ignorance, but where did these measurements come from?

Is this something the Prusa software can now do?

 

Posted : 02/01/2021 8:49 pm
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