Bed Adhesion Frustrations
As of late I've been having some adhesion issues with PLA just not sticking or lifting/warping at the corners.
Previously, dish soap worked wonders for me when IPA stopped working, and it still gets the first layer to stick but it always seems to start warping/lifting as the print goes on, brim or no.
I bought and tried some nail polish remover marked as 100% acetone today as I have put a number of hours on this sheet already and figured it might be time for the mentioned acetone refresh, but it did nothing for me.
So I've now tried IPA, acetone, and dish soap. (Note when I use dish soap, I scrub with paper towel and then rinse until water stops wetting the sheet - i.e it beads and sheets right off like with a clean non-stick pan)
Bed temp is 60C. Have tried lower (50) with no success, since PLA usually starts to warp if it's too hot, unlike other materials. Problem exists with a variety of PLAs.
Live Z is fine as far as I can tell, first layer looks almost smooth on the bottom, looks fantastic on the top, and just a smidge of elephant foot. If I go down further by 50 or so I start to see the characteristic rippling of a nozzle that is too close. And if I go up by about the same, I start seeing pinholes where the infill meets the perimiters.
What do I try next? Scotch-brite scrubber? Based on what I've read I shouldn't really be able to remove prints from a hot bed/sheet, but they come off fairly easily with a modest nudge or tug, probably because the corner has already started lifting.
I'm guessing this must be me, as I have a hard time believing there is such a thing as a "bad" PEI sheet shy of physical defects. I seem to have outlines of some previous PLA prints that are still visible on the sheet despite having been printed over many times.
Oh, and I always handle the sheet by the edges as much as possible; and have even taken to wearing nitrile gloves to remove prints and avoid getting what is affectionately know in the ATM keypad industry as "human slime" on the bed.
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
Smooth or PC sheet? I had the same issues as you with the PC sheet. I went to smooth a week ago and all problems solved....
Texy
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
Smooth or PC sheet? I had the same issues as you with the PC sheet. I went to smooth a week ago and all problems solved....
Texy
Smooth sheet, sorry. I forgot to mention that. Though I wouldn't be surprised if the underlying cause for both our issues is similar...
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
As of late I've been having some adhesion issues with PLA just not sticking or lifting/warping at the corners.
If this is a recent problem, could it be tied to environmental conditions? Are you printing unusually large prints? Temps in my home office have dropped to <18C/64F in the evenings. I've found I'm having more problems with warping, especially with larger prints, than I did during warmer months.
A Scotch-brite/3M 7445 pad should get it to stick as well as it's going to, but with a large enough piece, uneven cooling might still be a problem. You could try a brim or using gluestick.
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Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
As of late I've been having some adhesion issues with PLA just not sticking or lifting/warping at the corners.
If this is a recent problem, could it be tied to environmental conditions? Are you printing unusually large prints? Temps in my home office have dropped to <18C/64F in the evenings. I've found I'm having more problems with warping, especially with larger prints, than I did during warmer months.
A Scotch-brite/3M 7445 pad should get it to stick as well as it's going to, but with a large enough piece, uneven cooling might still be a problem. You could try a brim or using gluestick.
Unfortunately it's even noticeable with small pieces (e.g. 1" (2.5cm) square or less). I don't think ambient temp has fluctuated that much here and the printer is on my desk beside me so if there were drafts I'd be feeling them too, but I am working on building an enclosure just to minimize drafts and whatnot. So I guess I have that to look forward to.
Now that you mention it, I should try flipping my sheet. I have been doing mostly PETG prints on the other side before now, and flipped it to let the once I switched back to PLA. If the other side sticks fine with PLA it confirms it's not environmental.
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
So this is getting weird. Had a print last night that the first layer stuck ok (after a dish soap wash), then went to do the *exact* same print this morning in the same location... and it was a mess... first layer balled up and just would not stick.
I know I had not touched the bed in between as it's large enough and shaped so that I can carefully remove it without touching the bed or even having to remove the sheet.
Same roll of filament (left on the printer overnight in anticipation...) and everything. So I think I have an external source of contamination somehow. But I don't know where from. The filament's not popping or anything so it is sufficiently dry and my issues don't seem to be moisture related.
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
Seeing who is posted here I know you are in good hands. Note my experience with your type of build plate is limited for I own a PEI sheet. Two things you could try if the issue persists:
I have an enclosure, but as bobstro can confirm it comes with its own set of problem when dealing with PLA (the ambient temperature being too high). So be careful there.
3D Druck für Einsteiger leicht gemacht: www.3d-druck-lernen.de
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
I suspect my issues are interrelated... the contamination causing the first layer to refuse to stick at all is likely the same thing resulting in not enough adhesion to prevent the corners from lifting.
And yes, there are any number of magical consumables I can buy and apply to the bed, but that kind of defeats the point of a PEI print surface...
Edit: Since I have blue tape, I did try that. It stuck like no tomorrow and the only warping was minor and as a result of the adhesion between the bed and tape not being ideal with the tape lifting. But definitely not as severe as I was seeing on the PEI alone.
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
One last thought: PLA does not warp if you go beyond 60° C bed temperature. I am regularly printing with 70° C with good results. You could try that and also increase the print temperature a little.
Just to see what happens, so we can rule out a few more things.
3D Druck für Einsteiger leicht gemacht: www.3d-druck-lernen.de
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
For me the way I scrub the Powder coated sheet is key; the scrubbing action first in one direction and then at 90 degrees to that direction.
wash it with warm water and dawn dish soap (in the UK use Fairy liquid) by using a wad of clean kitchen paper towel dampen with warm water and put a dollop of Dawn on the pad and scrub (i do it twice at 90 deg to each other holding the plate by the edge as it is a phonograph record rinse under running water and dry with clean paper towel keep touching only by the edge... I do this every other day of printing with both kinds of plate. if you are having problems with the upper layers detaching the standard advice is to increase the temperature at the hot end.
also consider a hard factory reset and clear data then start over from the Preflight page in the manual.... and then of course use the support chat and ask to be transferred to a shift supervisor some of the techs are better than others with the tough problems.
Re: Bed Adhesion Frustrations
Defintiely something on my (non-PC) PEI sheet... I flipped it like I said I was going to do and the first layer stuck first time after an alcohol wipe.
This is my PETG side so it's normally been wiped with windex and has that residue on it; perhaps I should windex my other side before the alcohol and see if that helps...