0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S  

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

O.35 nozzle or initial layer thickness?  

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

@charles-h13

I'm referring to the Preset Print Settings. Here are two pictures showing what I mean.

When I select MK2.5S as printer, I have these options:

https://imgur.com/a/F5C0Ufd

When I select MK3S as printer, I have these options:

https://imgur.com/a/EFcHPjT

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Posted by: @ryker

I've had an MK2 and then MK2.5S for a long time and like to print with it's 0.35 Print Setting. I recently purchased an MK3S and when I choose this as my printer in Slic3r, there is no option for 0.35. It instead has 0.3 as it's max. Why? How can I get 0.35 on MK3S?

Thank you for your time and help.

Hello and welcome to the Prusaforum!

You can adapt the existing profiles in PrusaSlicer to your nozzle diameter (layer width, height, flow rate, feed rate etc...) and save it as a new profile. Prusa has only defined profiles for the most common nozzles in the Slicer.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

@karl-herbert

Hello and thank you!

This is not about nozzles. Both the MK2.5S and the MK3S have the same 0.4mm nozzle. What I am inquiring about is why Slic3r has a preset 0.35 print setting for MK2.5S but not for MK3S.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Just to clarify, when I say 0.35mm print setting, this is referring to the layer height of the print.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Posted by: @ryker

@karl-herbert

[...] This is not about nozzles. Both the MK2.5S and the MK3S have the same 0.4mm nozzle. What I am inquiring about is why Slic3r has a preset 0.35 print setting for MK2.5S but not for MK3S.

Without knowing the history of where and when you acquired Slic3r, it's hard to say how you managed to get a 0.35mm profile into your software installation. I can tell you that PrusaSlicer has only shipped with 0.25, 0.40 and 0.60mm profiles since forking away from Slic3r. 

How can I get 0.35 on MK3S?

Just load up a profile that's close (e.g. 0.4mm) and modify the nozzle size and other settings you care to, then save it with an appropriate new name. Don't forget to make adjustments to extrusion widths and layer heights to match. I've got notes on the procedure here and some sample profiles here that might be useful.

Be aware that Prusa has made recent changes to the dependency system used in PrusaSlicer. In particular, the Prusa-supplied filament profiles are now tied to the base printer. If you want to use a Prusa filament profile with another printer (perhaps a printer settings profile you've created from scratch), first save off copies of the filament settings profiles. They'll then show up in all your profiles with a "detached" suffix.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Thanks guys.  I was have trouble understanding the question.  

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

lol I don't think you guys are understanding the question. I appreciate the time you've taken to respond but again, I am not talking about nozzle sizes. I am referring to the layer height presets in the Print Settings drop down.

I am using Slic3r 2.2.0 and as  you can see from the screenshots I linked above, if I choose MK2.5S as my printer, I have a 0.35mm layer height option in the Print Settings dropdown list. If I choose MK3S as my printer, the highest layer height I can choose from the presets is 0.3mm.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

why not choose 0.3mm and then change the layer height to 0.35mm manually?

Chances are it will work reasonably, and if it doesn't, then maybe Prusa were right...  the Mk2 used to print 0.35mm for me ok, and that printer had a smaller hobbed gear.... 

regards Joan

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

@joantabb

Yeah I can go through the settings and compare to make my own custom 0.35mm print setting profile for the MK3S, I'm just wondering why it doesn't have it and then MK2.5S does. The MINI also has this issue but the MINI is worse because not only does it not have 0.35mm but it also doesn't have 0.3mm. The highest print setting preset it has is 0.25mm.

Doesn't make sense for the MK2.5S to have 0.35mm preset and the MK3S not to.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Posted by: @ryker

[...] I'm just wondering why it doesn't have it and then MK2.5S does.

At one point, 0.3mm layer height profile was removed for the i3 Mk3. The reasoning at the time was that it didn't really reduce print times. It has since been added back. If you look at the PrusaResearch.ini file, you'll see that there is are still settings for some printers that don't necessarily correspond to other printers. Specifically:

# MK2 #
[print:0.35mm FAST]
[...]
compatible_printers_condition = printer_notes=~/.*PRINTER_VENDOR_PRUSA3D.*/ and printer_notes=~/.*PRINTER_MODEL_MK2[^\.].*/ and nozzle_diameter[0]==0.4

This profile is only for the Mk2 series with a 0.4mm nozzle. Look a bit further, and you'll see:

# MK3 #
[print:0.35mm SPEED @0.6 nozzle MK3]
[...]
compatible_printers_condition = printer_notes=~/.*PRINTER_VENDOR_PRUSA3D.*/ and printer_notes=~/.*PRINTER_MODEL_MK3.*/ and nozzle_diameter[0]==0.6

Prusa provides a profile for 0.35mm layer heights for the Mk3 with a 0.6mm nozzle mounted.

The MINI also has this issue but the MINI is worse because not only does it not have 0.35mm but it also doesn't have 0.3mm. The highest print setting preset it has is 0.25mm.

Prusa has to make decisions about what profile configs they'll support. The more variations, the greater the number of variations to support. They seem to have decided on a range of common settings for each printer and committed to those. You're free to vary, of course, but support may not spend time with you once you move off the supported profiles.

Doesn't make sense for the MK2.5S to have 0.35mm preset and the MK3S not to.

It does from a support perspective. What they provide is what they support. You can change whatever you like and save custom profiles as was described previously, but if you contact support, they may ask you to switch to a baseline profile for troubleshooting. As to why the Mk2 series that specific option, that may have to do with Prusa having not updated those profiles for a while since the printers are well out of warranty by now. It works. Don't "fix" it.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

@bobstro

Thank you for the detailed response. My only issue with all three printers having three different max layer height profiles is that if you're using these printers for business and are building up a printer farm, these differences complicate things. I have designs that I've printed with my MK2.5S using the 0.35mm profile and sold to customers.

I ordered the MINI because of the marketing Prusa has put out saying it's good as a print farm printer. Turns out that is definitely NOT the case. I had ordered two and when the first one arrived I realized all the shortcomings it had (i.e. no saved z layer heights for different sheets, printer screen lockout during octoprint control, much lower max layer height preset, very different speeds for the same layer height presets as MK2.5S so the finish of the product is shinier than prints on the MK2.5s, etc.). I had to then cancel my second order and switch it to an MK3S in the hopes that the final print quality/look would more closely match that of what I've been producing with my MK2.5S for over a year. Last thing I want is for a customer to order something they've ordered in the past and it now looks different and doesn't match the older product they have.

So now I have a "print farm" of three printers and they all produce different results because the presets don't match. Yes, I know I can make my own profile but I'd rather use a preset that is known to work and is supported. I don't have time to fiddle with settings. Anyways, /endrant lol

Thank you all for your time and help. I created this post because I could not find anything about this anywhere which was surprising. Made me think I was going crazy or missing something obvious.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

Posted by: @ryker

[...] Thank you for the detailed response. My only issue with all three printers having three different max layer height profiles is that if you're using these printers for business and are building up a printer farm, these differences complicate things. I have designs that I've printed with my MK2.5S using the 0.35mm profile and sold to customers.

I agree with your intent, but not your conclusion. It's because I want consistency between my printers that I want to develop my own profiles that I know will work. Vendor-provided profiles can be updated at any time and may include changes I don't want showing up in my prints until I've vetted them. In most cases, Prusa's profiles have moved towards my "custom" settings over the last few years. I'm a curmudgeon that way.

A lot of users, yourself included, are much more invested in 3D printing than I am. I'm a hobbyist with 2 printers. That said, I've helped people with print farms double their output for printing PPE and streamline production for tabletop scenery, so I'm not just bumbling into this.

For things I want to print consistently, I don't even use PrusaSlicer interactively. I've got multiple script snippets for:

• Each printer type: Baseline hardware settings for the build plate, etc.
• Each nozzle size: Minimum and maximum layer height
• Each filament type
• Each print variation

I've got a crude shell script (being reworked in python) to call these to build a suite of hundreds of test prints for each combination in a few minutes. I find this much more reliable than trying to slice every iteration manually. The tabletop scenery guy put this to use allowing empl0yees to print pre-generated models in a variety of filaments and finish.

Essentially, what I'm saying is: If you want consistency, don't rely on the Prusa (or any other 3rd party) supplied configs that might be subject to change. Roll your own, so to speak.

I ordered the MINI because of the marketing Prusa has put out saying it's good as a print farm printer. Turns out that is definitely NOT the case. I had ordered two and when the first one arrived I realized all the shortcomings it had (i.e. no saved z layer heights for different sheets, printer screen lockout during octoprint control, much lower max layer height preset, very different speeds for the same layer height presets as MK2.5S so the finish of the product is shinier than prints on the MK2.5s, etc.).

I really wanted a Mini, but when the COVID lockdown started, I had to pull the trigger quickly and wound up with an Artillery Sidewinder X1. It's definitely a different beast than the Mk3, but by applying my standardized approach, I've got a good set of configs that work reliably with it as well.

As for the Mini, I follow some of the discussions, but I'm dismayed by the unwillingness of some users to try basic steps, so I have quit participating in those discussions. I've become a Mk3 curmudgeon. When I first received my Mk3 (Mar 2018), there were similar issues with PINDA v1 probes, but the community worked on identifying workarounds and improvements. I've found that my "PINDA warmup" routine has benefits for prepping the printer as a whole for a consistent print, so have felt no urgency to upgrade to the PINDA v2 sitting in my drawer.

With any printer, I encourage everybody to push into what the printer can do and not be limited by vendor-provided defaults. After all, they have to try to come up with settings that will work for every idiot. I only need settings that will work with ONE idiot.

[...] So now I have a "print farm" of three printers and they all produce different results because the presets don't match. Yes, I know I can make my own profile but I'd rather use a preset that is known to work and is supported. I don't have time to fiddle with settings. Anyways, /endrant lol

I took it more as "I don't have time to NOT fiddle with developing a good set of profiles". I'm pleased that I'm getting pretty consistent results between the wildly different Prusa i3 Mk3 and Artillery Sidewinder X1 printers. Using my Mk3 results as a target, I tweaked my Sidewinder profiles until the results were consistent -- at least for my purposes.

Thank you all for your time and help. I created this post because I could not find anything about this anywhere which was surprising. Made me think I was going crazy or missing something obvious.

No worries. Everybody has their own requirements and own approach. I do understand Prusa's position though. They've got finite resources to allocate to activities that don't generate profit. This includes enhancements to the slicer and profiles they are providing for free. These concerns are amplified when they want to support (as in, allocated staff & $) a specific set of profiles.

RE: 0.35 Print Setting Missing for MK3S

@bobstro

Thank you for the detailed response. I ran into your start Gcode a few weeks back and have since incorporated it into my printers after realizing how much better the MINI start routine is compared to the MK2 and MK3. Thank you for making that start gcode public!

Turns out you're right and even using the same 0.2mm profile on the MK3S, the print comes out different than that of a 0.2mm profile on the MK2.5S. The two preset profiles have different speeds depending on which printer I choose and thus, the finished print looks shinier on one printer than on the other. I had to edit the speeds of the MK3S 0.2mm profile in order to get a more matte finish with the Prusament Galaxy PLA like I've been getting with the MK2.5S for over a year.