powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate  

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

[...] "Prime Line," "Skirt Line," I'll get the vernacular down. Lots to it, and I'm definitely still learning myself.

I have been very OCD with the cleaning as I figured that was a major factor. Good! I see a lot of folks trying to blow past the 1st layer issues and get on with printing, and it's going to be tough without (literally) a good foundation.

As for 'z' setting I have lowered it and I can lower it more, just uncertain at what point I am creating a new problem. The test grid adheres well and the small rectangular print at the end measures .24mm, and I presume that should be sufficient. If I am still too high please advise.You might find the "Life Adjust" procedure simpler to use and understand than the on-board Live-Z route. It lays down a large (75x75mm) square and makes it easy to see the impact one layer has on the next. When you've got your Live-Z set right, you can drag a finger over the lines without them being dislodged.

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

I had the same issue and aslo found that thin based items, especially, need a skirt.

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Thanks to all for the replies. I have solved a major issue and that was ozzing around the hotend. It seems my kit version hotend was not fully seated, i.e., the nozzle was not flush inside the extruder, I disassembled it and rather painstakingly cleaned it as PLA was in the threads and everywhere else. The problem was not so much my z-setting though I have lowered it until I could see through a jewelers loop that the material was embedded in the rough surface of the print bed. The oozing was just enough to catch on my prints and knock those loose, hence the many failures. Started a large print and so far so good which is the same phrase the man who jumped off a building said as he passed each floor. Thanks again for the advice. I'll be using the forum again I am certain. Best, Steve

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

I too am looking at having to make a choice between the smooth and coated bed.

I've been using the smooth bed for six months, and it seems to work great. I don't always use glue for TPU's, it didn't hurt bed but can trash poorly printed parts.

I do find the bed very sensitive to z height, 30 microns would be too much.

I guess other than a bumpy part surface, has anyone noticed any benefits to the powdered bed?

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Just got my powder coated steel sheet 😛 (ordered with the printer in Sep 2017 😯 ).
It does make an absolutely beautiful first layer, which will greatly improve the look of printed objects.

I printed a whole pile of calibration squares yesterday and here are some preliminary findings:
* The powder coated sheet measures about 300um thinner than the regular sheet (1.07mm vs. 0.77mm).
* I had to adjust Z down by about 350um to get a proper first layer -1.015 > -1.365).
* It seems a bit harder to get a perfect first layer. The Z difference between a calibration square that doesn't fully hold together (Z to high) and one that ripples (Z too low) is small and as I experimented at different times of the day, I found that the mesh bed leveling accuracy was not good enough to get a repeatable perfect layer. I assume this is due to PINDA probe temperature sensitivity (ambient changes (garage) + heating from other elements).
* At the right Z, I found no adhesion issues whatsoever (I have only tried PLA) without any particular treatment of the sheet (just the usual alcohol cleanup).
* Even though it is hard to get a perfect calibration square, I found that the following layers are just fine and once the following layers of a real object are printed, the first layer looks perfect anyway due to the texturing, so overall the result is excellent, regardless of the Z variations.

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

I have mien dialed in and I have similar findings. The PEI stciker sheets just seem more sticky to me.

Re: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

So far, I've heard a BUNCH of ways to make the powder coated sheet almost as good as the flat one.

I've had the flat one for a year and it has seen a few KM of filament.

What is it the powder coated one does that's better?

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

The powder coated provides a better texture on the underside and may release some print better.  

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Compared the to the regular PEI sticker sheet plate, the powder coated plate sucks. I love the finish, but adhesion is not good -- very inconsistent. The PEI sticker sheet just works every time.

Yes I re-calibrated for the Powder coated sheet, and dialled in the z-height according to Prusa recommendations.

If I print something in the middle of the powder-coated plate, it's fine. It sticks, and I get that lovely finish.

But I printed two designs which covered the full width of the build plate yesterday (each were 21.5cm wide, 7cm long, with 150.5cm2 of plastic printed directly on the plate, as the base). The corners lifted in both parts -- but the parts were still held to the plate by the rest of the base. So I printed again after washing and IPA cleaning. The corners lifted again. The edges away from the ends were fine.. but the corners looked like bananas.

The finish on the base looked really nice, except that it had curved. I don't know what to do here.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

run the bed hotter

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Posted by: david.a66

run the bed hotter

I'll give it a crack. Currently at 60C. Cheers.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

I went to 70 and things did improve, but still not perfect. I use the smooth sheet now....

Texy

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Posted by: Texy

I went to 70 and things did improve, but still not perfect. I use the smooth sheet now....

Texy

Yeah, there's an issue with these sheets. Maybe they need time to season or something. The finish is nice, but not worth the headache if you can't get consistent adhesion.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

After much turmoil with powder coated sheets, resolved by scrubbing with Dawn, I have settled on the following regime:

PEI sheet: PLA

Powder Coated sheet: PETG. 85C bed, nozzle at 230C if the filament recommends it. I don't exceed recommended.

Very happy with both now.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Posted by: rmm200

After much turmoil with powder coated sheets, resolved by scrubbing with Dawn, I have settled on the following regime:

PEI sheet: PLA

Powder Coated sheet: PETG. 85C bed, nozzle at 230C if the filament recommends it. I don't exceed recommended.

Very happy with both now.

It'd be nice to have some input from Prusa here. I'm going to go to the eShop chat tonight to see what they say.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Posted by: kieran.s4

Posted by: rmm200

After much turmoil with powder coated sheets, resolved by scrubbing with Dawn, I have settled on the following regime:

PEI sheet: PLA

Powder Coated sheet: PETG. 85C bed, nozzle at 230C if the filament recommends it. I don't exceed recommended.

Very happy with both now.

It'd be nice to have some input from Prusa here. I'm going to go to the eShop chat tonight to see what they say.

Hello.

I have the same problem. Did you talk with the support? They say something about it?

I'm currently using a hardened nozzle so, plus the warping, If I down the Z too much the pla stick to the nozzle more than the bed.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

this was printed in PLA, on a textured build plate with no surface treatment other than being clean, there is approximately 1mm wide contact line holding the parts to the bed, the bed was at 70C 

Prior to the print I washed rinsed and dried the print bed,

regards Joan

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

I don't want to come across as argumentative, but it's time for Prusa to acknowledge that there are issues with the powder-coated textured sheet. I have calibrated my Live-Z:

With a lot of work, including washing under the sink with Dawn and a generous application of acetone, I can get small parts to adhere:

(red are PETG, green are PLA)

The problem is it is simply not reliable. No sooner than I get a good print:

than the next part warps:

I know how to adjust Live-Z. I know how to clean the bed. The textured powder-coated sheet is not reliable for printing PLA. It's not dirty. It's not too high or too low. It's unreliable. Even looking at it you can see the inconsistent quality of finish, from the uneven coloring between left and right to the blobs at the top:

 This is not a question of misinformed users not knowing how to use the product, how to calibrate or how to clean. I spent over 45 minutes online with support, sending these same pictures. They agreed that the 1st layers were quite good, but finally just resorted to "it's a consumable" and refused to help. Needless to say, after waiting 14 months after arrival of my printer (itself delayed 4 months) I am disappointed.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

To be clear: I'm not claiming that all of the PC sheets have this issue, but clearly one or more batches do. Rather than blowing us off, I do wish Prusa was spending more time trying to identify any commonality between the bad sheets and the good ones to avoid repeating this problem. I'm not after a refund. I'm just annoyed as hell.

RE: powder coated PEI steel sheet - less sticky than PEI sticker build plate

Posted by: bobstro

 This is not a question of misinformed users not knowing how to use the product, how to calibrate or how to clean. I spent over 45 minutes online with support, sending these same pictures. They agreed that the 1st layers were quite good, but finally just resorted to "it's a consumable" and refused to help. Needless to say, after waiting 14 months after arrival of my printer (itself delayed 4 months) I am disappointed.

I understand that they are consumable. But mine is new. I received it on wednesday