Printer Broken, not sure where to start  

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

Hi Sean, 

none of the 'Original Prusa' models had a plastic frame, so what you have, is a Clone of some sort. 

can you give us some pictures to work on?  please also  include a picture of the electronics... and the extruder

If the frame is broken, you need to resolve that issue first. 

Tom Sanladerer did a series on making a cheap Clone of the Prusa I3.    you might find some ideas in the video's 

regards Joan

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

So I am going to apologize for both the length and the number of pictures. It may get broken into multiple posts, so I don't lose anything, and this way it requires less trimming to quote a section.

I did go thru and recatalog all of the pieces I had, and only found three items that were broken. Two of them don't seem to be a big deal, but I think the third may be an issue.

First is the main square frame. It has a crack along the top, as well as two cracks along the bottom. Each of them is clean enough that I think I should be able to glue them back together, as long as I am careful with the top crack, as the crack goes thru a slot.

The next part is for one of the Z axis rods. It broke along a screw line as well as a linear bearing. It also looks like a clean break, and I think it is also repairable, with caution taken. Second pic is me holding it back together.

The last part is the most troubling. One of the diagon pieces that sits front/back has sheared off at the bottom, losing both tabs. I "think" the tabs on each are what hold the Y axis perpendicular to the main square frame, and am unsure how to do that with this split. There is a pic of them both together, as well as a closeup.

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

Now for the electronics. The front panel is supposed to sit on top of the main square, according to the person I bought it from. There are two screw holes right over the Prusa cutout that seem to verify this. Took front and back pics of the board, second pic is the pins above the screen on the front.

The next pics are of the power supply. A cording to the previous owner, someone upgraded it with the black box on top for a switch, etc.

Sorry, it won't let me upload right now. Posting so I don't lose it, will try again in a few minutes and edit this post.

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

So when I tried to edit it, it timed out on me. So going to put in another post, sorry.

This is the sides of the power supply. According to the previous owner, someone had upgraded/modified it and added the black box with the power switch on top. The last picture is of the black part removed.

Next is the heated bed. There is some kind of foam/cloth attached with kapton tape around the edges, but the tape is starting to pull up. Removed some, and lifted the cover to take a picture.

This is a picture of the main board, and since it says Gen-2 is one reason I thought it was an MK2.

Lastly is the hot end and extruder. As I said earlier, it was either ordered with a Bowden extruder or was modified into one. The extruder motor was mounted at the top of the main square, and had a PFTE tube coming down to the hot-end (visible in the hot-end picture). The last picture shows the attachment plate for the hot-end from the top.

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

Lastly is a picture of the current state of the printer. As you can see, I have threaded rods, linear rods, a bunch of cabling, thermistors, etc. I tried to only capture what I thought would help differentiate this from other printers.

I do think I discovered who made the printer, as when I was poking around trying to find a replacement frame last night/this morning, I ran across a couple of Amazon links. It looks like RepRapGuru's sells an almost identical clear frame, and they have a V1 (looks more like mine) and a V2, where the screen has a dedicated spot inset on the top of the main square. Mine do not have a slot on the bottom of the diagonals, and mine does have the Prusa i3 cutout on the top of the main square, but this is the closest builder I have seen that is similar.

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

That does look a lot like a reprap guru printer.  Not a terrible start, if you bought that off ebay as parts you are in good company.  The power supply is decent, the extruder is junk, the motors are decent, the heat bed should be an old mk2b clone.  I could not tell what mainboard you have, mine came with a ramps.

I bought a wood frame for mine a while ago because the acrylic frame came in the same condition.  When ever I get to a point where i'm not changing something on my other two printers i'll put this one together.  

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

So how easy would it be to convert this to a "regular" extruder, instead of the bowden? I have added Micro-Swiss hotends to my Makerbots before. I am thinking I just untread the bottom from the lever part on the extruder motor, and screw in the hot-end to the AL block on the nozzle. I may need to figure out how to fit it onto the carriage though.  I bought it off FB, and knew the frame was broken when I bought it. I think reprap gurus has an instruction sheet for this board, when I typed MKS Gen-2z V1.2 into Google.

Still trying to figure out the best way to re-do the frame. Either I can buy a replacement frame for about $20, try to glue this back together, build one out of wood, or 3d print a frame. Ideas on best way forward?

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

@seanrastsmith

From what I could tell with my kit most of the parts were from the "prusa vanilla" design, only difference was they were injection molded not printed.  So that means the dimensions on the x carriage, specifically the rod spacing, were exactly as they are on the MK2-3S.  And THAT means you should be able to print out just about any of the prusa extruder variations and pop it on there.  There are lots of designs for extruders that will fit the prusa dimensioned carriage as well.  

I bought a wood frame for mine purely for aesthetic reasons.  I would not recommend going this route for a printer you intend on using long term.  Most would agree these days the best way would be aluminium extrusions.  Whatever you do I would recommend against trying to do anything with acrylic.  Even an unbroken acrylic frame will warp and age poorly, as will most unsupported wood.  

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

Acrylic is possibly the worst material for a 3D printer frame especially when it is screwed together with square nuts in noggins...  
Acrylic is very brittle and tends to self destruct when flexed. 
All of the 'Better' clones have moved to Extruded Aluminium frames.  this might be the better way for you to go. 

the MKS Gen2 Board is a better board than the old Ramps board. 
And your power supply has a cover over the mains and power connections.   (the 30Amp rating is more than adequate for a small printer) which is better than some low cost printers...

the filament drive mechanism looks like a Mk8 or Mk10 used in a Bowden configuration,  Most Original Prusa Printers are Direct Drive. the exceptions are Mk2 with MMUv1 and the latest Original Prusa Mini. 

Your Extruder, appears to be a poor copy of the E3Dv6, I expect that the PTFE tube goes all of the way to the rear of the nozzle. which leads to overheating of the PTFE. 

The real e3dV6 looks more like this, 
Your heatbed is very unusual, a it is a large aluminium plate which is only heated in the middle. 
Mechanically, if you take a plate of aluminium and heat it in the middle, whilst leaving the outer edges unheated, you will get a bulge in the plate the centre may go UP or DOWN. it will not stay flat. this is a shame,
I think I see your lower chassis in the box. if this is undamaged  you may be able to use this with A Prusa Mk2/3 style main frame

(Funsor, offer an aluminium composite frame, on Aliexppress...) 
A Bear, or Haribo frame would probably be better, but at greater cost

your decision really has to be... 
do I know enough to work forward with this project and is it worth the investment, knowing that what ever I do, i will have a 'Non Standard' Printer?

or should I keep these parts to play with and actually invest in a printer that has a good support group and is likely to be easily maintainable?
Maybe something like this 

Obviously, original Prusa's are also available 
https://shop.prusa3d.com/en/
but these are more expensive.

regards Joan

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

Addressing the last part first, I have no problem with a "conglomeration" printer, as long as I know what came from where and how it may tie in with the whole design. This feels a bit like buying a rat-rod, where the Chassis is from one car, transmission from another, engine from a third, etc. Which is fine, once I know what I am dealing with, and where to find diagrams for that particular piece. I have enough general experience working with 3d printers that the slicing, fine-tuning, etc won't be a problem. This is just around "What do I have, and where did part X come from?".

So for the hot-end assembly, I think it is closer to the actual picture shown. When I unscrewed it, there is a stop machined about where the large rings start. The threaded portion screws up almost halfway in (looks to be about the lower four rings) and has no tubing. Looks to be all-metal for that hot end. Then of course is the Al Bock and nozzle. So this sounds like it isn't that big of an issue.

For the heated bed, I thought that looked a bit fishy as well. I took a picture of the undermount piece, as I think that is what you were referring to as far as adapting a more modern plate. It looks like this manufacturer was trying to make a "better mousetrap" than ReprapGurus, as they have these nice aluminum machined blocks to hold the linear bearings.

So as far as frame options, I know there are several. Right now I am thinking that the 3d printed frame may be the cheapest and easiest, followed by a wooden one (don't have a CNC, so a decent amount of hand filing). What is a cheaper option for an extruded AL frame?

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

This is the frame I found for my kit parts: https://ebay.us/TE8jit   I think it's a clone of the vanilla frame, but the seller has Mk style frames as well if that's what you are looking for.  So then I found a deal on a used 2S frame, Y axis and heatbed and a deal on a genuine v6 hot end so I changed gears and bascially rebuilt a Mk2S like I wanted it.  I was able to use some of the parts from the kit(motors, power supply, some hardware, the nice aftermarket aluminum bed support that somehow ended up in the kit ).  Your kit has come with some nice upgrades mine did not have; it's got actual z leadscrews instead of the older style threaded rod, and you have an MKS board which is going to be a lot easier to work with than a ramps.  You should be able to run the Prusa 3.2.3 firmware on it if you want to.  The dimensions of your rods and leadscrews will kind of dictate the direction you can go.  

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

@seanrastsmith

Did you post a link for the Printed Frame? I didn't notice it.
If you go with the Plywood frame, I would suggest that you use adhesive to increase the rigidity of the frame joints similarly assuming that the plywood Y axis plate has the same hole placements as the perspex one, I would consider using both together under the heatbed. to give a little additional robustness 
with the Flexible shaft couplings for the Z axis it is a good idea to butt the motor shaft end against the Leadscrew end, to prevent springiness in the coupling changing the layer height during use. 

Good luck with your efforts...     I have a Geeetech 13ProB, which has 8mm perspex frame, (A little more robust than the normal 6mm frame, ) it also had a mk8 extruder, but is now sporting a Prusa Mk3 style extruder. and is awaiting a magnetic heatbed and removable build plate setup

regards Joan

RE: Printer Broken, not sure where to start

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3626908

Here is the link to the 3d printed option.

Otherwise, looking at the folgertech 2020 for some dimensional guidance, looks like it is about $30-ish for the 20/20 cut to size, and then probably another 10-15$ for the attachment pieces. Which means something like the Bear/Haribo upgrade is also possible without spending too much.

Do you guys have a recommendation on which frame upgrade seems the best/easiest if I am planning on purchasing the 20/20 myself, and remaking the attachment pieces on another printer? Any of them open-source vs proprietary?

At that point, the next reasonable expense would be a heated bed replacement. For starters, I can run PLA on the existing bed without heat, but will want to upgrade soon. Options that don't break the bank?

If it turns out the hot-end is an actual E3d or a similar quality clone, and I swap the heated bed out and change up the frame, does that mean I essentially have a mk2(/s?) with a different frame? Or would this still be missing things a genuine mk2 or mk2s would have?