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[Sticky] Original Prusa XL is out!  

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Titan
(@titan-2)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

Prusa have never disappointed me with their kit but the XL has impressed me even more than I expected.  The development time clearly hasn't been wasted and there's so much useful tech included.  It's a clear step forward.  As much as I'd like to say I'm reaching for my wallet the machine's just too big for my needs, so I'll be holding off for the Prusa i3 MK4 and hoping some of the tech is transferred there.  Load cell sensor offering nozzle jam detection and no more first layer calibration?!  Yes please!  Looks excellent.

Posted : 19/11/2021 4:04 pm
MileHigh3Der
(@milehigh3der)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

From a print standpoint, for most people, this really doesn’t make a difference.  Bigger, yes, but with warping failed prints, big prints scare me.  Frankly, a mini prints big enough for almost everything people use.

What the XL brings for me is multimaterial that might actually work and that you can swap hot ends.  The swapping is key.  Take heads off and do preemptive maintenance rather than wait for prints to look funky, tear it apart and have to re-zero everything.  Or have it go down when you really need to get some prints done.

Going to be interesting to see how many people sign up.

Posted : 19/11/2021 4:49 pm
StanHD, Area51 and bobstro liked
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1

Posted : 19/11/2021 6:22 pm
Pixelmagic
(@pixelmagic)
Active Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

 

Posted by: @henryhbk

I thought it was both touch screen and scroll wheel?

Posted by: @mroek

There will be high demand, so I secured a place in the queue too, even if I don't know where to place this beast. Would be interesting to know the external dimensions, but that's not been published, as far as I can tell.

I do find it a bit odd that there is no touchscreen. Will it be possible to control the printer from a built-in web interface or app?

 

In an German video an employer more or less tells it is possible bot the final display, maybe it is there for the fair to have "something" to show. The product is not final and maybe there are some shortages on touch displays.

Posted : 19/11/2021 9:22 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

I agree and disagree.  A stock printer will not do it, but with substantial alteration and a new print bed, it it possible and has been done with an MK3S.  I would not waste the money doing it, but it can happen.  

Posted by: @thejiral

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 19/11/2021 9:39 pm
MileHigh3Der
(@milehigh3der)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

 

Posted by: @thejiral

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

 

Posted by: @cwbullet

I agree and disagree.  A stock printer will not do it, but with substantial alteration and a new print bed, it it possible and has been done with an MK3S.  I would not waste the money doing it, but it can happen.  

Posted by: @thejiral

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

 

I’m not looking to do functional parts, just low height chip sets and test coupons, so hopefully I can do that limited kind of print.  It will be interesting to see how many parts are inside the heated ‘chamber’, really a bucket.

 

Posted : 20/11/2021 3:48 pm
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

Of course, one can upgrade the extruder to handle the necessary nozzle temperatures within reasonable effort. If you reprint all the heat exposed plastic parts of the printer in PC-Blend and relocate all electronics outside of the enclosure (or in the case of XL maybe insulate them from the chamber) one could possibly heat up to 80 or maybe even 90°C before things go haywire. That might be enough to print something but it won't be fun. Given how expensive PEEK is I am not sure if many want to play around with it on a printer barely suited for it.

If you somehow can source the entire printer parts in Ultem or peek (probably horribly expensive) you might be even able to reach proper temperatures in the chamber but I am not sure how cables and motors will keep up under such conditions.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1

Posted : 22/11/2021 8:00 am
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

I think the heated chamber will be a passively heated enclosure.  

Posted by: @milehigh3der

 

Posted by: @thejiral

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

 

Posted by: @cwbullet

I agree and disagree.  A stock printer will not do it, but with substantial alteration and a new print bed, it it possible and has been done with an MK3S.  I would not waste the money doing it, but it can happen.  

Posted by: @thejiral

I fear I have to disappoint you but there is no way, that the XL will even remotely support printing PEEK. For that nasty super high performance material you absolutely need a heated build chamber and not just any but one that can heat up to seriously high temperatures (+100°C) which also means you can forget using any PETG inside the chamber. In other words, you need a serious industrial printer and then PEEK itself is horrendously expensive. There are "cheap" printers out there for 7000 EUR which have some PEEK printing capability but I heard they aren't fun at that either.

 

I’m not looking to do functional parts, just low height chip sets and test coupons, so hopefully I can do that limited kind of print.  It will be interesting to see how many parts are inside the heated ‘chamber’, really a bucket.

 

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 22/11/2021 10:15 am
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

And you will need a special bed surface.  

Posted by: @thejiral

Of course, one can upgrade the extruder to handle the necessary nozzle temperatures within reasonable effort. If you reprint all the heat exposed plastic parts of the printer in PC-Blend and relocate all electronics outside of the enclosure (or in the case of XL maybe insulate them from the chamber) one could possibly heat up to 80 or maybe even 90°C before things go haywire. That might be enough to print something but it won't be fun. Given how expensive PEEK is I am not sure if many want to play around with it on a printer barely suited for it.

If you somehow can source the entire printer parts in Ultem or peek (probably horribly expensive) you might be even able to reach proper temperatures in the chamber but I am not sure how cables and motors will keep up under such conditions.

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 22/11/2021 10:17 am
Helmuth
(@helmuth)
Eminent Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

 

Posted by: @neophyl

Mmm just take a look through the initial posts on the mini forum if you want a realistic answer to that.

Posted by: @helmuth

Very new to Prusa ownership here... got into the i3 when it's already been refined to the MK3S+.

What's the company's history on new product launches? Are they generally smooth, or do they tend to go through teething problems?

 

I had a quick look in that forum, and somewhat surprisingly, the threads about teething problems that I dipped into generally concluded with something along the lines "oh, I had obviously done something wrong and it's now fixed!"

Regardless, I'm in tech, where one of the driving mantras is "never buy version 1.0 of anything" 🙂

Definitely interesting seeing some of the videos covering the new features though, really interesting stuff.

Posted : 22/11/2021 10:52 am
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

There seem to be a few things that could be improved on the Mini from what I have read. Don't have one myself.

Generally expect long delivery delays and some teething problems in the beginning if previous launches are anything to go by. If you want a refined perfected product possibly it's best to wait at least for the first proper reviews on the XL, or maybe one iteration longer. It seems to be filled with many new approaches and designs, who knows how well they really work in day to day operation. I would also want to see first how reliable the tool changer is over time. But it's easy for me anyway, I don't have the space for this monster. 😉

I would be quite interested in the extruder approach though, especially the gear system. It is something fresh and new and could solve some very hard to come by minor issues of dual extruder gear printers like the Mk3s but also the Voron.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1

Posted : 22/11/2021 11:53 am
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
RE:

There is a little risk.  I, for one, purchased an MK3, MK3S, and Mini on the launch date and they have worked nearly perfect.  The hiccup was the wait.  

Posted by: @thejiral

There seem to be a few things that could be improved on the Mini from what I have read. Don't have one myself.

Generally expect long delivery delays and some teething problems in the beginning if previous launches are anything to go by. If you want a refined perfected product possibly it's best to wait at least for the first proper reviews on the XL, or maybe one iteration longer. It seems to be filled with many new approaches and designs, who knows how well they really work in day to day operation. I would also want to see first how reliable the tool changer is over time. But it's easy for me anyway, I don't have the space for this monster. 😉

I would be quite interested in the extruder approach though, especially the gear system. It is something fresh and new and could solve some very hard to come by minor issues of dual extruder gear printers like the Mk3s but also the Voron.

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 22/11/2021 1:43 pm
Steve
(@steve)
Estimable Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

Even if there wasn't, there are ethernet-to-wifi adapters, so you have the option either way.

Added my preorder within 5 minutes after I read the blog post. Also read that you can still configure it when you add the final payment so ordered it with 2 extruders at this point, might still make it 5 depending on how I feel about it in about half a year 🙂

Posted by: @cwbullet

Read the blog post.  I am pretty sure it a mentions wifi option.  

 

I will edit my order to add 5 print heads later.   

Posted by: @teachingthedetails

 

Posted by: @guyh

If you look at the new board there looks to be a wifi ariel adaptor on it.  

Interesting. In the details, they only list Ethernet though. 

 

 

MK3S / MK2.5S-MMU2S / Ultimaker 2+

Posted : 23/11/2021 9:46 pm
karl-herbert
(@karl-herbert)
Illustrious Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

@thejiral

I print PEEK with my old MK3 (CarbonPEEK from 3dxtech). To make this possible, I increased the power of the print bed heater and installed a PT100. No need an enclosure to print PEEK.

The fanshroud (see picture) was also printed from CarbonPEEK (print temp. 380 degrees C., bed temp. 150 degrees C.) and then tempered at 280 degrees C. (CarbonPEEK is equally my aluminum replacement material but, as you meant, extemly expensive).

wbr,

Karl

Statt zu klagen, dass wir nicht alles haben, was wir wollen, sollten wir lieber dankbar sein, dass wir nicht alles bekommen, was wir verdienen.

Posted : 23/11/2021 10:56 pm
Cullinaire, Painted Futures, Thejiral and 1 people liked
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

What do you use for a print bed surface?

Posted by: @karl-herbert

@thejiral

I print PEEK with my old MK3 (CarbonPEEK from 3dxtech). To make this possible, I increased the power of the print bed heater and installed a PT100. No need an enclosure to print PEEK.

The fanshroud (see picture) was also printed from CarbonPEEK (print temp. 380 degrees C., bed temp. 150 degrees C.) and then tempered at 280 degrees C. (CarbonPEEK is equally my aluminum replacement material but, as you meant, extemly expensive).

wbr,

Karl

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 23/11/2021 11:04 pm
Painted Futures
(@painted-futures)
Active Member
RE:

 

Posted by: @cwbullet

ok.  I am 100% certain I read it somewhere and I am as certain that it will have the means to have wireless capability.  The controller card has a threaded connector for an antenna.  

Posted by: @teachtheprints

 

Posted by: @cwbullet

Read the blog post.  I am pretty sure it a mentions wifi option.  

I couldn't find any info regarding WiFi, would be glad to be proven wrong though.

The blog post mentions nothing regarding connectivity. And the store page explicitely mentions this:

Ethernet connection: built-in

 

 

Where exactly did you read it? I'm curious to know, and if you read it on an official Prusa source it should be easy for you to find it again (Control-F "wifi")

This post was modified 6 months ago by Painted Futures
Posted : 24/11/2021 12:20 pm
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE:

I assume CarbonPeek is a bit more forgiveable to print than Peek, is it?
How well do you manage with dimensional stability and warping after cool down?

The fan shroud does look slightly bent but maybe that is just misleading on the image. Of course, for some applications like that fan shroud a slight bending isn't much of an issue.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1

Posted : 24/11/2021 12:22 pm
karl-herbert
(@karl-herbert)
Illustrious Member
RE:

"What do you use for a print bed surface?"

the textured PEI coated plate from Prusa and a kapton film (0.05mm). The original Prusa heating plate withstands the temperatures (no lost magnets). Extruder parts are printed from PEEK and nylon.

wbr,

Karl

Statt zu klagen, dass wir nicht alles haben, was wir wollen, sollten wir lieber dankbar sein, dass wir nicht alles bekommen, was wir verdienen.

Posted : 24/11/2021 4:11 pm
karl-herbert
(@karl-herbert)
Illustrious Member
RE:

@thejiral

The parts have good dimensional stability, minimal warping and after tempering temperature resistant up to approx. 260 degrees C. and extremely strong.

I have only printed 250 grams so far, since the material costs are 800Euro/kg at that time ( https://www.filamentworld.de/shop/high-performance-filament/peek-filament/3dxtech-carbonx-1-75-mm-carbon-peek/).

(tempering process at 280 deg. C.)

(nozzlechange tool)

 

Sorry for the bad pictures - were shot with an older cell phone.

wbr,

Karl

 

Statt zu klagen, dass wir nicht alles haben, was wir wollen, sollten wir lieber dankbar sein, dass wir nicht alles bekommen, was wir verdienen.

Posted : 24/11/2021 4:26 pm
Walter Witt
(@walter-witt)
Active Member
RE: Original Prusa XL is out!

Jesus Christ Dude, That's incredible. I woulda never thought parts like that from an I3 where possible. How big can you print without using a heated chamber? Do you think the XL will be a good candidate for this kind of printing?

Posted by: @karl-herbert

@thejiral

The parts have good dimensional stability, minimal warping and after tempering temperature resistant up to approx. 260 degrees C. and extremely strong.

I have only printed 250 grams so far, since the material costs are 800Euro/kg at that time ( https://www.filamentworld.de/shop/high-performance-filament/peek-filament/3dxtech-carbonx-1-75-mm-carbon-peek/).

(tempering process at 280 deg. C.)

(nozzlechange tool)

 

Sorry for the bad pictures - were shot with an older cell phone.

wbr,

Karl

 

 

Posted : 24/11/2021 5:58 pm
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