Input Shaper.......
How does this work with existing units? Is it a matter of a firmware update, or will it be an 'upgrade' and hence more parts required?
EDIT : Scrap that, just read its firmware.
RE: Input Shaper.......
The question still is relevant, even more as the kits are available now.
How do I get such an accelerator sensor for calibrating my kit printer after input Shaper is out in the firmware?
I do not think the kits come with such a sensor included.
RE: Input Shaper.......
That's a good point....!
RE: Input Shaper.......
Taken from the release blog:
"Input Shaper suppresses these effects by “learning” how the printer moves – this is done by placing an accelerometer in the extruder and interpreting the reported values. The MK4 doesn’t have a built-in accelerometer in the Nextruder, but there’s an accelerometer port on the xBuddy board. We use it to calibrate the Input Shaper and then you can use the pre-calibrated firmware without an accelerometer installed."
Would still be nice to have the option of getting my own accelerometer and calibrating myself for my own work environment to make it more accurate though?? As the port is on the xBuddy board it should be an option - do you think Prusa will make an accelerometer available, or there will be third party units available?
RE: Input Shaper.......
Input shaping calibration can also be done by printing a test print and choosing the layer height at which ringing is minimized. Just saying.
RE: Input Shaper.......
do you think Prusa will make an accelerometer available, or there will be third party units available?
I have no idea. Would be nice if they offer one as not everybody knows which thirs party device (if exists) works.
Input shaping calibration can also be done by printing a test print and choosing the layer height at which ringing is minimized.
Sure, that should work.
But I would prefer to do this automatically when the possibility is there. Does make less work and may be more accurate.
RE: Input Shaper.......
do you think Prusa will make an accelerometer available, or there will be third party units available?
What sense would it make to include a dedicated port for a accelerometer if such a accelerometer would never be available to use in the future?
So my assumption would be YES... 😀
But maybe most users will be satisfied with the Prusa-inhouse-preloaded profiles.
RE: Input Shaper.......
The xBuddy board has the accelerometer input, but only one. Shouldn't there be two, one for the extruder and one for the bed? They both move. Doing this in the factory only really needs one I suppose as they can set it up for one shaping at a time (?). The Love board doesn't have a port for an accelerometer though, so it would need to connect all the way to the xBuddy.
Adding an accelerometer to the extruder only solves one of the inputs, correct? Can one port recognize two accelerometers? If not, I suppose this will be the MK4S.
RE: Input Shaper.......
I suppose you could just do a double run of input shaping and move an accelerometer to a mount point on the print head and then to a mount on the bed. Wouldn't be something you need to do very often for most. I only ran input shaper once on my little Voron and that was the end of it. I printed a mount for the accelerometer, attached it, ran input shaper. ...and a few month later removed the mount and removed the accelerometer as it was just an extra weigh and wire hanging off the print head...
RE: Input Shaper.......
I left the accelerometer board mounted on the extruder of my Voron 2.4. It weights next to nothing ( no ill effects on the cinematic of the printhead). What I removed was the cable, it's one of these super light weight ribbon things that you plug/unplug just lifting a small tab.
Think that everytime you make a significant change on the set-up or the bench/table where the printer sits, it's advisable to run another test, because input shaping parameters will change.
RE: Input Shaper.......
I left the accelerometer board mounted on the extruder of my Voron 2.4. It weights next to nothing ( no ill effects on the cinematic of the printhead). What I removed was the cable, it's one of these super light weight ribbon things that you plug/unplug just lifting a small tab.
Think that everytime you make a significant change on the set-up or the bench/table where the printer sits, it's advisable to run another test, because input shaping parameters will change.
If you feel like it, it would be great to capture whatever parameters your printer has now, then move it, and re-do the calibration to measure how much change actually happens to the parameters.
But i realize it's work to do that...
RE: Input Shaper.......
@artur5 yup, mostly just the cable was left flopping when I first put it on. The weight is negligible for sure.
RE: Input Shaper.......
With the impact that a move can possibly have, however small, I don’t get why Prusa didn’t just include the accelerometer by default? It’s a cheap enough part, surely?
RE: Input Shaper.......
It will be really interesting to see how this shakes out. Sorry couldn’t resist. It is a curious omission, but you have to believe that significant testing was done and perhaps, as everything is relative with so many variables, the change in input shaping values was not super significant. Baseline input shaping parameters are probably “good enough “and I get the feeling that most Prusa machines stay with a fairly vanilla set up. And, I guess, as mentioned before by others, you need at least two built-in, accelerometers, print head and bed in order to have it auto calibrate. So the cost increases and time kit manual gets a few more pages.
On the MK3s they have a first layer calibration auto/print built into the firmware, perhaps they could add a input shaper test print in the firmware that could be run to tweak the baseline input shaper parameters when you make a change. Run the input shaper test print from a menu, evaluate the result and put the result back into the menu in the printer. It shouldn’t need to be done often I would guess. Can’t wait to get the beta input shaping firmware…
RE: Input Shaper.......
Has anything been said on how long we will be waiting for Inpt Shaper to be fully released?
Going by how long PrusaSlicer 2.6 is taking for a full and final release, I’m not holding my breath!
RE: Input Shaper.......
With the impact that a move can possibly have, however small, I don’t get why Prusa didn’t just include the accelerometer by default? It’s a cheap enough part, surely?
I'd bet they couldn't secure a large enough supply of accelerometers that also fit their requirements.
They've been very public about supply chain issues in the past, and they've also been very public about print speeds being a secondary concern for them. There's no way of knowing for sure yet, but I think their goal is for the default input shaping to be fast enough for the majority of their user base, and the open port on the printhead's sister board should make it very easy to install one aftermarket for the speed demon crowd.
Lists of reliable accelerometers exist already from Voron/RatRig/ other DIY printer sourcing guides, so all in all, acquiring and installing an accelerometer should be way easier than other common i3/Mini mods like hotend or extruder upgrades
RE: Input Shaper.......
What are Prusa like with such updates generally?
I dislike the way companies promise features that then take 6 months or so to be implemented!
RE: Input Shaper.......
What are Prusa like with such updates generally?
Think it took them 3 years to deliver WiFi on the Prusa Mini after it was released.
RE: Input Shaper.......
Hello,
I just noticed that Prusa stated: "The firmware is utilizing Marlin 2.0 to handle motion planning with significant changes to comply with the Prusa in-house developed technologies. The user interface, WebUI and other firmware parts have been fully developed at Prusa Research."
It is not based on KLIPPER so forget all that Klipper does. Prusa has done significant code rewrite to improve the performances and integrate the Buddy board features.
We must be patient: a good firmware is not written from one day to the other, and usually requires months or years. Marlin 2 has added the input shaper very recently around December 2022 but on its version 2.1.2 and it is considered still an experimental feature!
The MK4 seems to be at 2.0.x, so it will require months before Prusa will migrate to the new version.
Keep in mind that Marlin 2 isn't quite as stable as the well-established Marlin 1 and Prusa don't like to roll out unstable printers with experimental firmware that could compromise the whole MK4 functionalities, so I expect they will release a 2.1 with input shaper when they will be sure it is reliable (not immediately).
They are working hard on the code, fixing and adapting the features, and may be the result will be something new "derived by Marlin" but developed by Prusa for specific Prusa board and features. May be we will see something working well before Marlin exit from the experimental features.
So, forgot super-benchy speed race input shaped on the MK4 for the near months.
Best Regards
RE:
Think it took them 3 years to deliver WiFi on the Prusa Mini after it was released.
There is a joke in there about the time it took to deliver the WiFi, and the speed of the WiFi performs at in real life...
Still can't wrap my head around that, not sure if its a complete hardware blunder, or there is commitment to deliver Usable speeds?
Is there a way to get some clarity on that point? Or is it just ambiguous and the user finds out once they get the platform?
I can live with slow file transfer on the MK4 IF this is just a temporary software issue...If this is the speed the machine will Always have, then rethinking the purchase, as with the MK3 I can move files wirelessly with the flashair card fast and effortlessly. The other MK4 creature comforts I Want and are nice, but the file transfer is a Priority!