RE: PC printing on Core One
not really no...
The worst is Nylon, it will require a mandatory 48 hrs drying (if less than 90C) before it can be printed.... just a few hours of air exposure ruins it.
So, if it has not absorbed water (because it was not exposed to room air or other humidity at any time), it will not need to be dried, right? Really, Polymaker's statement "Drying only needed if the material has absorbed moisture" is a tautology.
RE: PC printing on Core One
I'm pretty sure I have the answer, and it's not good news. This part is only about 2" by 4" long, and even with the chamber right at 55c and a layer of Vision Miner nano-polymer adhesive applied to the satin sheet, the corners started lifting after the first 3 base layers. The inevitable crash and layer shift followed. I tried once more, slowing the speed down a bit, and again before the 4th solid base layer was done, the corners were lifting.
It looks like the Core One cannot do pure polycarbonate. I'll have to discuss options with my director to see if he's comfortable using one of the easier to print PC blends for our use case, or if we want to look into a more expensive printer that can hit higher temps.
-J
RE: PC printing on Core One
not really no...
The worst is Nylon, it will require a mandatory 48 hrs drying (if less than 90C) before it can be printed.... just a few hours of air exposure ruins it.
So, if it has not absorbed water (because it was not exposed to room air or other humidity at any time), it will not need to be dried, right? Really, Polymaker's statement "Drying only needed if the material has absorbed moisture" is a tautology.
The only companies products that I’ve run into so far that came with water in them was overture silk PLA… that specific one was just awful from the start and it finally dawned on me after reading a reply that someone had posted that it had water in it. it’s amazing to think that some manufacturers actually don’t dry their filaments.
RE: PC printing on Core One
A more positive update this morning. I was able to get a successful print out of the PC after a combination of things. The two main things were to dry the PC overnight (which slightly reduced the bits of thin stringing I saw yesterday, despite only having access to a 70c dryer) and adding mouse-ears to the corners of the part. The successful print was done at .25 layer height, with 4 perimeters, feeding filament out of the running dryer. The part itself is fairly thin, so the high number of perimeters was to support some screw risers. Otherwise the high perimeter count wouldn't have added to the warping force.
Round two this morning is to print a more difficult version of the model that includes all 4 sides. I've opted to drop the layer height to .2, and modified the side walls to have slots in them to reduce the continuous extrusions along the longer sides. I've also dropped the perimeter count to 2, and used a modifier to add perimeters to the risers. It's a ~2 hr print, so I'll know sometime in the next couple of hours if this more difficult print can be done on the core one.
If nothing else, this process is going to test the Core One at its full capacity. I'm running the bed, nozzle, and chamber at their max for the entirety of the prints. 😬 It's amazing how warm the steel case gets when the chamber heat is this high.
I need to reiterate that this is NOT a PC blend, but real PC from 3dxTech. I only know of two filament makers who sell real PC, 3dxTech and Airwolf 3d. It is more expensive than PC blends, and is harder to print, requiring much higher temps all around. It naturally results in stronger parts.
-J
RE: PC printing on Core One
Success follows success. 🙂 I had to modify this second model to minimize the long end warping forces, but the result is a 'flat enough' print that looks great and will probably be useable. I switched to the satin sheet and used nano-polymer adhesive again with large mouse-ears. The print stayed visually flat throughout the print, and I only noticed the slight curvature after removing it after it cooled off on the printer. It's possible that the chamber cooled off too fast.
-J
RE: PC printing on Core One
Congratulations on your success! Even after all these years there are still things to learn about how to design, slice and setup. Glad you found a path forward.
Regards,
Steve
P.S. you could probably easily implement some post print G-code to step down the heatbed temperature more slowly to slow the chamber cooling and avoid even the cooldown warping if necessary.
RE:
P.S. you could probably easily implement some post print G-code to step down the heatbed temperature more slowly to slow the chamber cooling and avoid even the cooldown warping if necessary.
That's a good idea. I run a very small PC fan at the end of a 4" exhaust hose to keep a very minor negative pressure in the chamber during printing, and adjust to allow the chamber to hold 55c the whole time. Once the print is done, I should probably turn that off and provide some step down on the bed.
-J
RE: PC printing on Core One
I just finished assembling and test-printing with the Core One.
I also want to use Polymax PC now and the question is should I go with textured or smooth sheet? Glue?
RE: PC printing on Core One
For Prusament PC blend I always use the smooth plate AND adhesive. My usual choice is 3Dlac, but for huge parts more likely to warp, I use Dimafix, which seems to work better with the bed at high temperature ( 100C or more ). Setting a wide brim in the print settings helps also to avoid problems.
Polymax PC might be quite different from Prusa's PC blend regarding bed adhesion and warping, so take my opinion with a few grains of salt.
RE: PC printing on Core One
PCBlend on the CORE One prints as well as on my MK4S with enclosure. Since my parts are long and thin (3mm wide, 15 cm long, 3cm tall), I had to use extra pads built in the model and even then, if the satin plate (with 3DLAC) isn't perfectly clean, the parts will detach and warp. I also found significant differences on the various FW releases in term of quality. Since the FW is far from stable, I didn't research that too much, it is planned for a later time when the C1 FW will stabilize a little more.
RE:
Check this thread:
The Cryogrip Pro Glacier plate is an excellent cheaper alternative to the Satin plate with one minor caveat on the Core One – General discussion, announcements and releases – Prusa3D Forum https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/postid/764416/
I have bought one and it is definitely better than any other plate for PC Blend that I own, no gluestick needed and comes away cleanly without damaging the surface once it cools down, it's not the holy grail so will probably still require a brim for some prints but a lot better than the Prusa satin plate, oh and cheaper 🙂
Normal people believe that if it is not broke, do not fix it. Engineers believe that if it is not broke, it does not have enough features yet.
RE: PC printing on Core One
@chocki Do you have any feedback w/r to warping with this plate? My major issue is warping (due to object shape) and much less detaching at the end...
Check this thread:
The Cryogrip Pro Glacier plate is an excellent cheaper alternative to the Satin plate with one minor caveat on the Core One – General discussion, announcements and releases – Prusa3D Forum https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/postid/764416/
I have bought one and it is definitely better than any other plate for PC Blend that I own, no gluestick needed and comes away cleanly without damaging the surface once it cools down, it's not the holy grail so will probably still require a brim for some prints but a lot better than the Prusa satin plate, oh and cheaper 🙂
RE: PC printing on Core One
Question: aside from Prusa PC CF, are there any other moderately cost carbon fiber PC brands out there that print well?
I’m pretty sure I have one roll somewhere at the house, but the Prusa stuff is insanely expensive in the United States. For the life of me I’m not seeing polycarbonate carbon fiber anywhere from any of the common vendors here (Polymaker, Elegoo, Atomic, Vortex, etc.)
RE:
Question: aside from Prusa PC CF, are there any other moderately cost carbon fiber PC brands out there that print well?
I’m pretty sure I have one roll somewhere at the house, but the Prusa stuff is insanely expensive in the United States. For the life of me I’m not seeing polycarbonate carbon fiber anywhere from any of the common vendors here (Polymaker, Elegoo, Atomic, Vortex, etc.)
I tried this one: IEMAI PC CF but in my experience, it was crap. Printed directly from the dryer, started with the Prusa PC CF profile, then tweaked it based on IEMAI's settings from their website and did not get decent interlayer adhesion. Was just too brittle in the Z direction, even after annealing. Sent an email to IEMAI, they wrote back reasonably quickly with proposed settings but same thing.
There is this as well YXPOLYER PC-CF which seems to have decent reviews. However, at this point I'm the proud owner of a (very rare) roll of Prusa PC-CF so not going to take a gamble on it.
- Bob Marley
RE: PC printing on Core One
Just reporting back;
100% success rate with 1:1 white school glue (PVA) + distilled water and 5mm brim, smooth sheet, using polymaker polymax PC.
RE:
Question: aside from Prusa PC CF, are there any other moderately cost carbon fiber PC brands out there that print well?
I’m pretty sure I have one roll somewhere at the house, but the Prusa stuff is insanely expensive in the United States. For the life of me I’m not seeing polycarbonate carbon fiber anywhere from any of the common vendors here (Polymaker, Elegoo, Atomic, Vortex, etc.)
Prusa PC-CF is finally back in stock: https://www.prusa3d.com/product/prusament-pc-blend-carbon-fiber-black-800g-6/
Get it while you can. It tends to sell out quickly. Can get it here as well: https://www.matterhackers.com/store/l/prusa-prusament-pc-blend-carbon-fiber-3d-printer-filament/sk/MLZQTF84 which with "free" shipping is the same price as Prusa + shipping...
- Bob Marley
RE: PC printing on Core One
Holy crap! $90/roll. It's not worth that...
RE: PC printing on Core One
Holy crap! $90/roll. It's not worth that...
Yup, which is why I'm hanging on to what I currently have and looking for an alternative. The Prusa pricing is a "reasonable" $60 but then there is the $20 shipping to the US... One of my side hobbies is model rockets and I considered PP-CF (due to heat and chemical resistance, low density) but it's even more expensive so I've been gravitating (more like flip-flopping) between PA and PC.
- Bob Marley
RE: PC printing on Core One - how to dry it?
@TeamD3dp: Regarding: "How on earth am I going to find an affordable filament drier they can get anywhere near 120c?", the answer would be to use a kitchen oven.
120°C is 248°F, so any oven, even a large countertop toaster oven, can do that.
If you did not want to use your kitchen oven for drying, and prefer an economical bench-top drying oven for your workshop, this one has an extended cook timer that can run for 10 hours at up to 450°F: Hamilton Beach Digital Convection Toaster Oven model 31190C, $131 USD. It is also perfect for drying your silica gel and Alumina desiccant.
Cheers,
Neal
RE: PC printing on Core One
If you did not want to use your kitchen oven for drying, and prefer an economical bench-top drying oven for your workshop, this one has an extended cook timer that can run for 10 hours at up to 450°F: Hamilton Beach Digital Convection Toaster Oven model 31190C, $131 USD. It is also perfect for drying your silica gel and Alumina desiccant.
I have a similar one that I use as well for annealing printed parts. It's half the price of the Sunlu E2 which get's up to 110C but it's a bit pricy for what it does.
- Bob Marley