Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection  

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

On the number of heads, I really can’t think of any scenario where I will need 8 for a print personally. Upside is having 8 filaments set up and ready to go. But just to have this luxury it’ll really depend on price point. Assuming I don’t get cold feet in the meantime about being an early adopter, I’ll stick with 4 heads but will likely get a selection of nozzles. At the moment I only have use for 2 filaments for my prints but I will experiment with multi colour pla for the kids. Novelty, so 4 heads/colours is plenty. Based on that I’ll probably get 4x 0.4, 2x 0.6 nozzles, 2x 0.8 and at least one of each size hardened. I could convince myself of scenarios where more would be needed but right now i have no jobs and will save the pennies for when i do. That’s the beauty of the indx, can buy more in the future.

now all that said, if additional nozzles end up only being a small bit cheaper than just getting another head then I’ll probably just go with 8 heads.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

On the number of heads, I really can’t think of any scenario where I will need 8 for a print personally. Upside is having 8 filaments set up and ready to go. But just to have this luxury it’ll really depend on price point. Assuming I don’t get cold feet in the meantime about being an early adopter, I’ll stick with 4 heads but will likely get a selection of nozzles. At the moment I only have use for 2 filaments for my prints but I will experiment with multi colour pla for the kids. Novelty, so 4 heads/colours is plenty. Based on that I’ll probably get 4x 0.4, 2x 0.6 nozzles, 2x 0.8 and at least one of each size hardened. I could convince myself of scenarios where more would be needed but right now i have no jobs and will save the pennies for when i do. That’s the beauty of the indx, can buy more in the future.

now all that said, if additional nozzles end up only being a small bit cheaper than just getting another head then I’ll probably just go with 8 heads.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @wdlandry

now all that said, if additional nozzles end up only being a small bit cheaper than just getting another head then I’ll probably just go with 8 heads.

I think there is only a $200 difference between 4 and 8

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

I've never really seen the appeal of the 0.6 nozzle.  A few years ago it was all "0.4 is dead. Hail the new King, 0.6". At least for what I'm printing, where detail sort of matters, 0.6 was visibly inferior while mostly not offering much—if any—time savings. 

So I think I'm going with (hardened) 0.4 for all heads, plus one 0.2 for text (can't really see a scenario where I would need 2), and a 0.8 for coarse work. 

My thought was to go with the four head configuration but now I'm drifting more into the 8 head camp. Not that I see why I would ever need 8 heads at a time but that way I can leave all the different size nozzles in and avoid nozzle swapping. 

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @hyiger

 

Posted by: @wdlandry

now all that said, if additional nozzles end up only being a small bit cheaper than just getting another head then I’ll probably just go with 8 heads.

I think there is only a $200 difference between 4 and 8

I wouldnt get much change for 4 CHT nozzles on the nextruder from 200eur. So at that price point I may stretch it and just not install them until needed  🤣 

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @foxrun3d

I've never really seen the appeal of the 0.6 nozzle.  A few years ago it was all "0.4 is dead. Hail the new King, 0.6". At least for what I'm printing, where detail sort of matters, 0.6 was visibly inferior while mostly not offering much—if any—time savings. 

So I think I'm going with (hardened) 0.4 for all heads, plus one 0.2 for text (can't really see a scenario where I would need 2), and a 0.8 for coarse work. 

My thought was to go with the four head configuration but now I'm drifting more into the 8 head camp. Not that I see why I would ever need 8 heads at a time but that way I can leave all the different size nozzles in and avoid nozzle swapping. 

I think 0.6 gives a nice best of both worlds. For larger prints I'll always lean to 0.6 assuming I don't need detail. Tbh I tend to swap between 0.4s and 0.6s more often. I rarely use 0.8 and have never used a nozzle smaller than 0.4, never really had the need. 

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @foxrun3d

I've never really seen the appeal of the 0.6 nozzle.  A few years ago it was all "0.4 is dead. Hail the new King, 0.6". At least for what I'm printing, where detail sort of matters, 0.6 was visibly inferior while mostly not offering much—if any—time savings. 

So I think I'm going with (hardened) 0.4 for all heads, plus one 0.2 for text (can't really see a scenario where I would need 2), and a 0.8 for coarse work. 

My thought was to go with the four head configuration but now I'm drifting more into the 8 head camp. Not that I see why I would ever need 8 heads at a time but that way I can leave all the different size nozzles in and avoid nozzle swapping. 

0.6mm gives better layer adhesion and warp control for large functional parts using engineering filaments. I've found it easier printing PC and ASA with a 0.6. Usually for these parts, detail is not important. For coarse work, i.e. infill I think the 1mm will be perfect. 

For sure I will get all of the nozzles hardened. 

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Following ... It's time to consider what I should choose. The L-sized T-shirt is clear but what nozzles ...

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

I expect to use different nozzle sizes in different projects, but no more than four nozzles in any given print. I asked Bondtech support whether it will be easy to swap nozzles and got a helpful reply -- so I am comfortable with ordering the 4-nozzle configuration now:

 Question:

I ordered the INDX Founders Edition for the Core One, and expect that the decision between 4 or 8 tools will come up shortly. I have a question in preparation for that:

I do not expect to need more than four tools in any given print, and would actually prefer the four-tool configuration because it leaves more space and visibility around the printer. But I will need more than a total of four different nozzles across different projects.

Is it easy to change just a nozzle to set things up for a new print? (Connect to the PTFE tube, clip into the tool holder, prime?) Or should I plan to have all nozzles online that get used somewhat regularly, and hence get the 8-tool configuration?

Bondtech answer:

For using more nozzles than 4 if you have the 4 tool setup on the printer, it is no problem. You can have as many spare tools as you would like. What you need to do if you change a tool to another tool that you have extra, you will need to do a new X-Y-Z nozzle offset calibration for only that tool. Then you are ready to go again. Currently, the firmware is still under development. So I can not give you any sharp details about it yet how it will work. But there will be solutions so you can have more than 4 tools on the side and use then whenever you want to change them.

As a side note, the comment also seems to confirm what I guessed regarding nozzle calibration: It will be necessary to calibrate the XYZ position of each nozzle tip, presumably using the load cell and a target object (permanently installed pin or such) for the XY probing. But the calibration data for all installed nozzles will be stored by the firmware, so it is not required to calibrate before each print.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

I've flipped back to only 4 nozzles as well. What changed my mind is that I'm building the INBXX and I just don't have the space for the 8 spool version. Also, I really don't have a desire to print more than 2 colors. So I'm now gravating toward

1. 0.4
2. 0.4
3. 0.6
4. 0.6 and 1.0

Why the 1.0? Infill and quick drafts

RE:

I haven't had a multi-material printer, but based on my current usage of my single-material printer(s): I think the biggest enjoyment I find from an INDX system would be reducing the start-up time and friction of printing with different filaments. I load and unload filament so often, I think that having my 4 most common filaments pre-loaded on the machine in air-tight boxes will remove a pain point and make printing much more enjoyable. 

So in that sense I might just have 4x standard 0.4n. By the same logic I suppose having 4 additional slots for different nozzle sizes / hardened / etc would reduce friction even more when printing. So maybe: 

• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.25n
• 0.6n
• 0.8n
• ??

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @ujindesign

I haven't had a multi-material printer, but based on my current usage of my single-material printer(s): I think the biggest enjoyment I find from an INDX system would be reducing the start-up time and friction of printing with different filaments. I load and unload filament so often, I think that having my 4 most common filaments pre-loaded on the machine in air-tight boxes will remove a pain point and make printing much more enjoyable. 

So in that sense I might just have 4x standard 0.4n. By the same logic I suppose having 4 additional slots for different nozzle sizes / hardened / etc would reduce friction even more when printing. So maybe: 

• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.4n
• 0.25n
• 0.6n
• 0.8n
• ??

You should only go for hardened nozzles since they last longer. As soon as E3D produces a Diamondback for the INDX I'll be buying those. Some of my filaments have to go in a dryer before printing and some can only be printed whilst drying. So I don't see myself having 8 filaments "locked and loaded" unless I'm doing multi-color PLA. FOMO kept forcing me to go with 8 but now I see 4 as the better option. For an 8 nozzle setup I would do something like: 0.2,0.4,0.4.0.4,0.4,0.6,0.6,0.8 (or 1.0)

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @hyiger

 As soon as E3D produces a Diamondback for the INDX I'll be buying those. 

Can E3D also make nozzles with steel body + diamond tip? I understand that the current Diamondback nozzles use a brass body, but the inductive heater on the INDX needs steel?

RE:

Posted by: @jurgen-7

Can E3D also make nozzles with steel body + diamond tip? I understand that the current Diamondback nozzles use a brass body, but the inductive heater on the INDX needs steel?

I'm pretty sure the current nozzles have hardened steel bodies. Looking at mine that definitely seems the case. 

RE:

I anneal rifle cartridges using induction, brass heats up very good. Different calibration from steel necessary I guess.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @greenpea

I anneal rifle cartridges using induction, brass heats up very good. Different calibration from steel necessary I guess.

Sure, you can induction-heat any metal via induced eddy currents. But in ferromagnetic materials you will get a much more efficient energy transfer via the additional magnetic hysteresis losses. In the INDX use case, where you want the fastest possible heating and lightweight induction coils, I don't think brass nozzles would be a valid option.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Hello,

I’m also trying to figure out which INDX and nozzle configuration to go for. I’ll definitely never use all 8 nozzles, but I have a few questions in mind:

In the first few months after the Founder Edition is released, how difficult will it be to order new nozzles?
Will changing nozzles be quick and easy?
(I find it simple on the Nextruder, but sometimes it’s a hassle to swap them for different sizes.)

Here are the options I’m considering—any thoughts on which makes the most sense?

If swapping nozzles is a pain, I’ll get 8 tools with a mix of sizes (0.2, 0.4, 0.6 or 0.8) even if I only use 4 at a time.
If ordering parts will be tough in the first few months, I’ll order 8 tools but only install 4.
If Bondtech guarantees fast delivery of extra nozzles, spare parts, etc., I’ll stick with 4 tools and buy different nozzle sizes as needed. 

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @staldy

In the first few months after the Founder Edition is released, how difficult will it be to order new nozzles?
Will changing nozzles be quick and easy?

Changing the nozzles is supposedly easy but requires a new (automated) calibration of the new nozzle's XYZ position. That's exactly what I asked Bondtech about; see my earlier post here. 

The concern about availability of extra nozzles is justified, but obviously only Bondtech will be able to answer that. Maybe the manufacturing bottleneck will be in building the extruder units and they will have plenty of nozzles right away; maybe it's the other way round.

RE: Bondtech INDX Nozzle Selection

Posted by: @jurgen-7

Changing the nozzles is supposedly easy but requires a new (automated) calibration of the new nozzle's XYZ position. That's exactly what I asked Bondtech about; see my earlier post here. 

Oops, I missed this part of the topic, my bad!

Thank you.