RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
I think they look pretty good after your work. Ghosting on Y face is probably x-belt just a little bit too loose.
Nothing I see indicates a motor fault.
Yes, 45 degrees is additive issue. You won't get that to completely go away, but I think agree it is a nice step forward going to the 0.9's.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Is this firmware & motor modifications really necessary to get rid of the banding? I'm getting really frustrated to this "feature" on MK3 and don't really feel start swapping motors or modifying firmware. To me it seems that Prusa has got sloppy when trying to push a new printer models as fast as possible out to the market. My old MK2 printed much smoother objects. Too bad that I already sold it when I bought MK3. 😣
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Unfortunately, VFA's appear to be an inherent "feature" of the stock MK3 and MK3S. No amount of work on the bearings, alignment, belts really makes them go away. The 0.9 motors makes a dramatic, positive change.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
I have the Bondtech extruder upgrade (standard one from their website for the MK3), and the changes to make the MK3 a 3s (including the add on parts to make the new sensor work properly with the bondtech upgrade). So I already have to use a modded firmware. If I changed my X and Y motors to 0.9 motors, what would that mean for me getting altered firmware for upgrades?
I already failed badly trying to compile code and make my own...and with it being such an important part and easy to create a brick, I stopped trying and rely on the powers of others.
Upgraditis says I want to do this upgrade...but realism says I will be in hell trying to get firmware upgrades for my system if I do. Any insight?
Oh, and I LOVE your work, thanks!
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Oh and for others looking for an idea of some .9 results I uploaded the full resolution pictures of my results here: (it makes a difference for some small fine features):
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1KcJP43_hyOJNwXpcu3uBFVOeb_9XqFyn
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
You are the man!
Where are the instructions found? I will give it another try.
What is a good place in the YS to buy moons 0.9?
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
I have the Bondtech extruder upgrade (standard one from their website for the MK3), and the changes to make the MK3 a 3s (including the add on parts to make the new sensor work properly with the bondtech upgrade). So I already have to use a modded firmware. If I changed my X and Y motors to 0.9 motors, what would that mean for me getting altered firmware for upgrades?
I already failed badly trying to compile code and make my own...and with it being such an important part and easy to create a brick, I stopped trying and rely on the powers of others.
Upgraditis says I want to do this upgrade...but realism says I will be in hell trying to get firmware upgrades for my system if I do. Any insight?
Oh, and I LOVE your work, thanks!
I just upgraded my MK3S with Bondtech with .9 moons on X and Y. If you are scared of compiling firmware, here is the link to the 3.7.1 BMG .9 motor on X and Y .hex that I am using (thanks to all the hard work and research of guy-k2!) You can upload it through slic3r without compiling anything. However, if you follow his directions it is very easy to compile and hard to make any errors because you are just uncommenting a few things. Still, I was intimidated too at first so here’s the file:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bAiyjX-77BzZ8QR_v8WG89d_CviTq0Ta/view?usp=sharing
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
My firmware for 0.9 support has a more extensive readme section for firmware compilation.
It also has support for your BMG / Bondtech gearing/Z-height/filament speeds. Should only have to flip a few defines in Confguration_prusa.h file to match your hardware.
Get to where you can test compile on your computer. Then flash directly from Arduino. It's pretty easy once you do it once.
I think my instructions will be a bit easier to follow than Prusa's
Most common gotcha is forgetting to edit config.h to set the language to primary only. Failure to do that puts garbage chars on LCD.
https://github.com/guykuo/Prusa-Firmware/blob/0.9-Degree-Stepper-Support/README.md
download from here
https://github.com/guykuo/Prusa-Firmware/tree/0.9-Degree-Stepper-Support
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Oh and for others looking for an idea of some .9 results I uploaded the full resolution pictures of my results here: (it makes a difference for some small fine features):
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1KcJP43_hyOJNwXpcu3uBFVOeb_9XqFyn
Did I interpret the results wrong if it seems that just updating to bondtech alone creates a huge difference? To my eye X,Y 0.9 Moons don't give much improvements to standalone bondtech. What the bondtech upgrade would mean? I have Mk3 and it has already double sided gearing for filament extrusion.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
What is Arduino? Isn't it a hardware thing for firmware testing? I do not have such a thing.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
No extra hardware
Arduino is also the name of the Arduino IDE. You need the IDE to compile firmware. https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/Software
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
My firmware for 0.9 support has a more extensive readme section for firmware compilation.
It also has support for your BMG / Bondtech gearing/Z-height/filament speeds. Should only have to flip a few defines in Confguration_prusa.h file to match your hardware.
Get to where you can test compile on your computer. Then flash directly from Arduino. It's pretty easy once you do it once.
I think my instructions will be a bit easier to follow than Prusa's
Most common gotcha is forgetting to edit config.h to set the language to primary only. Failure to do that puts garbage chars on LCD.
https://github.com/guykuo/Prusa-Firmware/blob/0.9-Degree-Stepper-Support/README.md
download from here
https://github.com/guykuo/Prusa-Firmware/tree/0.9-Degree-Stepper-Support
I would really encourage anyone who is afraid of compiling firmware to just jump in and try it. I know I put it off for a long time and tried Moons 1.8 motors because I was worried about messing something up.
But when I finally just did it I realized I had been worried over nothing. Obviously this has everything to do with guy-k2 giving good directions and making the changes just some simple comments/uncomments. Seeing the process however, I would now be comfortable with changing some other simple settings (ie like I will be doing to try and optimize X homing.) TMC driver settings and things like that are still above my head, but again you don’t have to touch any of that.
Since I have been doing lots of modifications on my printer, I’m glad this thread finally forced me to learn how to compile so now I have more options in the future.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Oh and for others looking for an idea of some .9 results I uploaded the full resolution pictures of my results here: (it makes a difference for some small fine features):
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1KcJP43_hyOJNwXpcu3uBFVOeb_9XqFyn
Did I interpret the results wrong if it seems that just updating to bondtech alone creates a huge difference? To my eye X,Y 0.9 Moons don't give much improvements to standalone bondtech. What the bondtech upgrade would mean? I have Mk3 and it has already double sided gearing for filament extrusion.
You are correct in saying that for me the Bondtech showed the biggest jump in improvement. This is because the stock setup is jsut pretty bad with extrusion consistency. The stock MK3 has the Bondtech gears but I am referring to the Bondtech 1:3 geared extruder (105$). https://www.printedsolid.com/products/bondtech-prusa-i3-mk2-5-mk3-extruder-upgrade
You are right that the jump in quality with the .9 motors is less, but that’s just how it is with the technology. Once you deal with bigger problems smaller and smaller ones rear their head and you have to jsut decide if it’s worth it to you. I have fun tinkering and trying to get the last 5% of quality so it’s worth it to me. (Plus as many have noted it is hard to really convey in pictures the improved quality.)
You also have the option of not doing the Bondtech and doing .9 motors on X, Y, and E. Some have reported similar improvement in extrusion to the Bondtech that way.
I guess it’s all relative too—some are perfectly happy with the stock quality but I just didn’t find it acceptable.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
1. Motor harness mismatch can cause motor to not move. There are two pinout standards. Get a mismatch and stepper only makes a tiny single move and stops. These work with Moons https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07CBV8DVZ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Can we use the existing wiring, or do we need the new wiring with the Moons?
Also, the 4100s are out of stock on Amazon (says not sure if they will ever be in stock again), but the 4200s are in stock and appear to be the same thing (from what I can tell). Are they?
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Also, when you say to uncomment out the line, do you remove just the // or both the // and the #
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Just the //
//means ignore everything after //
# is part of the command being commented out
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
I see the MS17HD2P4100 as in stock at Amazon.
Do NOT use the MS17HD2P4200. It is NOT the same.
That is a 2 amp motor and will likely overheat the TMC2130 drivers.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Also if you are tired of looking at little test cubes here is an actual print with the new motors. Pretty nice! You can see a few VFAs where it is at a 45 degree angle but that’s about it. This filament is also very nice (and cheap lol) at .1mm it almost seems like there aren’t any layer lines.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
You are correct in saying that for me the Bondtech showed the biggest jump in improvement
My experiences is that the 0.9 motors change had a larger effect than going geared on the extruder. However, it depends on whether your machine's main artifacts are VFA's or vibrations. Doing the Bondtech also changes the mass load and therefore the vibrational modes. It is pretty easy to confuse VFA's and other fine vibrational artifacts. VFA's are always vertical. Don't change with velocity - so they never tilt or curve.
RE: Stepper Motor Upgrades to Eliminate VFA's (Vertical Fine Artifacts)
Also if you are tired of looking at little test cubes here is an actual print with the new motors. Pretty nice!
THAT is what a print should look like from a machine that is praised for good print quality. Thanks for sharing that beautiful result