Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Don't worry, there are only a few minor problems in FW with new features, which will be fixed ASAP. I'm very happy with the printer right now, just look at these prints:
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Assuring someone that someone else is going to do something in the future is a bullshit thing to do and drops your credibility to zero.
On the average, the Mk3 works and will produce decent prints out of the box. Perhaps a telling benchmark here is that the printer is probably good enough to print most of the fixes for the printer. (Can't print a new PSU of course.)
However, those of us who know better know that this machine can be doing much better. This was evident from the beginning.
If you're looking for a finished printer, THIS PRINTER IS NOT FINISHED.
Do not buy one on the false promises (and false assurances) of future fixes or support. They might come, they might not. PR might support you, might not.
Buy one if you have looked over everything and it meets your needs right now, as is.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
If none of the above were involved then the bigger multinational companies would have printers coming out their ears, but they don't for a reason. Lets face it we are dealing with molten plastic being applied down to an accuracy of 50microns for periods of time up to 30+ hours in some cases for an audience of people who expect 110% all of the time.
It's my opinion that the fundamental barrier to cheap, reliable, consumer-grade 3D printing is really just a matter of mass-market adoption.
If Apple thought they could sell 50 million 3D printers in a weekend, they would invest the R&D to create a design that works out of the box and could be mass-produced cheaply. But that consumer market doesn't exist yet, so it's not worth the product development.
If you think about it, the technical challenges in 3D printing really aren't any harder than making a color laser printer or an iPhone (different, but not inherently harder). A lot of the gap between the hobby-levels printers we have today and a truly consumer-ready product is mostly a matter of lots and lots and lots of testing and design tweaks to find all the places where things might fail and design around them.
As just one example, think of the materials we use to print. ABS, PLA, PETG, and HIPS work pretty well, but we use those mostly because they're readily available off the shelf and in small quantities. Out of all the thermoplastics out there there's probably something better. However, nobody's willing to invest the money it will take to do a thousand hours of printing with a thousand different materials to find the ideal material, especially if that involves asking DuPont to whip up a bunch of custom formulations. But in the context of the R&D that goes into a mass market consumer product, a few million bucks to test different materials is pocket change.
We are still in the pre-Apple II era of 3D printing, and nobody has invented the equivalent of Visicalc yet.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Hello there 🙂 It is a big surprise to see problems on support forum of self assembly kits, right? There is almost 4000 MK3s in the wild in just 2 and half months to give you a perspective.
Let me go thru the OP list:
OctoPrint Problems - Fixed in last few firmwares.
Bearings problems - What problems exactly? You just see couple of guys telling they suck and they switched to Misumi. Same bearings as on the MK2S. Wrongly sent rods are being replaced for free.
Belt Problems - What belt problems? If you misalign them, they rub on the idler pulley, but not causing any harm. Same as with MK2/S.
X axis has no belt tensioning mechanism - Did you see the manual? There is exact way how to tension them properly. Same as with MK2/S
Power supply failure - Not above average we saw with MK2S, but everyone just freaks out about MK3.
Fail self test - Well, something was connected improperly during assembly and self test caught that 🙂
Fan Errors - Printer is detecting the fan isn't having the proper RPM. Again printer is detecting what it should. So far we saw broken wires of the PCB during the assembly barely making contact.
Heated Bed failure - You probably mean thermistor wire getting pulled? Addressed in the article.
Calibration fails - Most common cause is that people put the filament holder to the front preventing the printer to reach full Z, or they put Z nuts upside down, or they have something preventing the axis movement....
Filament sensor problems - fingerprints on the sensors, dust, etc. 3.1.1 FW introduces some mechanisms to be more robust too.
With these ones I have no idea what do you mean?
XYZ Axis Fine Tuning - ?
XYZ Axis Problems - ?
Print resume bug - ?
Everyone keep calm and print on 😉
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Hallelujah !!!! Brothers and sisters 
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Hej Josef!
Thanks for your input! Awesome number! This puts the problems in to perspective!
The belt problem maybe is the wiggly X belt that rubs on the idler. I literally spend a whole evening loosening and retightening the x motor, its pulley, taking the x back off three times.
I was NOT able to make the wiggle go away. The belt still squeaks and degrades.
But in your article you wrote that new x axis parts are in the making! I personally put all my hope in these and hope they arrive not too way down the road.
Greetings!
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Thank you Mr. Prusa ... and important that you also comment on the MK3 problems ...
Print resume Bug: https://shop.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-i3-mk3-f30/mk3-print-resume-bug-t13453.html#p63498
Axis Tuning and Problems: https://shop.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-i3-mk3-f30/fine-tune-your-mk3-y-axis-t13851.html#p64144
https://shop.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-i3-mk3-f30/fine-tune-your-mk3-z-axis-t13806.html#p62401
We hope that the newly delivered MK3 ready assembled and kits are already modified and will not continue to be delivered as faulty. After all, having to print spare parts yourself makes a cheap impression ...
Otherwise, PRUSA will probably lose its reputation and sink to the level of "China Toy".
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
I have been reading these forums since ordering a MK3 I feel most of the problems seem to be mostly USER errors rather than printer errors ( Most of Printer problems seems to have been sorted now with the current firmware)
I think people need to remember because of PRUSA the technology is being pushed to us at affordable prices and like anything new problems cant be totally found until its given to the masses to try. At least they are trying to push the boundaries of what's possible with each printer, you have to respect them for that.
I wouldn't cancel, get the printer and enjoy it. its a high quality REPRAP, its a Hobby and it will be tweaking and messing with things all the time and that's part of the fun I think.
If you do cancel wait for the Chinese copy's to appear and get one then, then you'll wish you hadn't cancelled and original.
Happy printing!!
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
I have been reading these forums since ordering a MK3 I feel most of the problems seem to be mostly USER errors rather than printer errors ( Most of Printer problems seems to have been sorted now with the current firmware)
I think people need to remember because of PRUSA the technology is being pushed to us at affordable prices and like anything new problems cant be totally found until its given to the masses to try. At least they are trying to push the boundaries of what's possible with each printer, you have to respect them for that.
I wouldn't cancel, get the printer and enjoy it. its a high quality REPRAP, its a Hobby and it will be tweaking and messing with things all the time and that's part of the fun I think.
If you do cancel wait for the Chinese copy's to appear and get one then, then you'll wish you hadn't cancelled and original.
Happy printing!!
So how's your printer working for you so far?
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Like other's have said only you can decide if you should cancel or not. Personally I couldn't be happier with my MK3. I had a few failed prints as I was dialing in the settings (I have it in a cool ambient environment with no enclosure) but many many successful prints. I've run it off of SD and through octoprint. I've printed with PLA and PETG. I took my time during assembly and had no issues during calibration. For me it has been the best purchase I've made in years.
To your comment about having to make spare parts, I can't understand how that is a negative. Would it be better to not have that ability and pay a premium price for proprietary parts when you need them? Nothing says you have to print spare parts, but unless you have a second 3d printer it just seems to make sense, it's a machine and parts in a machine can fail.
To Josef's comments this is a support forum where folks come and ask for and receive help so if this is your view of the MK3 world then it is a distorted view for sure.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Do not cancel !!! 😮 😮 😮
May I use your "order time slot" to receive my printer sooner? 😀 😎 😆
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
Disclaimer: I'm not the OP, and the following is merely *my* impression.
My views are likely skewed a bit, since I mainly read the MMU forum, and a bit of the MK3 forum.
To your comment about having to make spare parts, I can't understand how that is a negative.
I *think* he meant that he had to print replacement parts that differ from the delivered parts, because the community says that they work better.
That is at least the sentiment I feel is going around.
(Not passing any judgement as to wether or not the community parts ARE better. Just stating.)
To Josef's comments this is a support forum where folks come and ask for and receive help so if this is your view of the MK3 world then it is a distorted view for sure.
True enough.
What I think is weird, is that for an official support forum, there seems to be little official support or response.
There are several threads talking about improvements or replacements, not just daydreaming, but apparently thoroughly thinking it through, and few if any have any kind of official reply. Even if it were just "Guys, we tried that, didn't work." or perhaps "Thought about that, too expensive to mass produce" (something like that was a reply to the idea of an official enclosure).
I do understand that they (Prusa guys) have a lot of work and can't really spend time idly browsing, but a bit more involvement would be nice nonetheless. It would certainly reduce some of the tension.
I don't think everyone coming here will take into account that people mostly post problems (a universal problem), and those whose machines work flawlessly don't have any reason to post.
---
Personally, I'm now less certain than I was before that I want to buy an MK3 (or MK2S for that matter). If I were looking for a single-material/color printer, I'd go for it.
But I want multi-color/material, and I'm not convinced that the MMU is the way to go. (I'm also not convinced that other methods are, though.)
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
........
True enough.
What I think is weird, is that for an official support forum, there seems to be little official support or response.
There are several threads talking about improvements or replacements, not just daydreaming, but apparently thoroughly thinking it through, and few if any have any kind of official reply. Even if it were just "Guys, we tried that, didn't work." or perhaps "Thought about that, too expensive to mass produce" (something like that was a reply to the idea of an official enclosure).
I do understand that they (Prusa guys) have a lot of work and can't really spend time idly browsing, but a bit more involvement would be nice nonetheless. It would certainly reduce some of the tension.
I don't think everyone coming here will take into account that people mostly post problems (a universal problem), and those whose machines work flawlessly don't have any reason to post.
This one has me in a holding pattern... Joseph made the blog post about reworked X axis parts. I've been patiently waiting to see what they are before considering the reworked axis by RHDreambox. He's put a lot of thought into the parts and what he's come up with makes a lot of sense to me... The other thing posted in the blog was regarding the replacement of the spiral wrap with braided wrap for the heatbed my unit shipped on the 19th and he made the post on the 22'nd and my unit came with spiral wrap, no big deal $5 on Amazon gave me a lifetimes worth of braided wrap, but I'm guessing they figured out the spiral wrap was and issue prior to the 1/22 blog post.. My other issue with the printed parts is that most of the parts on the repository are still Revision 1 parts so any issues being found on those parts may have been addressed several revisions ago. I know none of the parts that were with my unit were marked R1...
Personally, I'm now less certain than I was before that I want to buy an MK3 (or MK2S for that matter). If I were looking for a single-material/color printer, I'd go for it.
But I want multi-color/material, and I'm not convinced that the MMU is the way to go. (I'm also not convinced that other methods are, though.)
I really want multi color of some sort and am going to start looking at The Pallette though it's a bit spendy for the limited information I can find on it...
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
I don't think everyone coming here will take into account that people mostly post problems (a universal problem), and those whose machines work flawlessly don't have any reason to post.
There appear to be plenty of posts from people who think their machines are working flawlessly.
There are even plenty of posts from people celebrating the laurels of machines they literally don't even have in hand.
Somehow these people still find a reason to post.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
There appear to be plenty of posts from people who think their machines are working flawlessly.
There are even plenty of posts from people celebrating the laurels of machines they literally don't even have in hand.
Somehow these people still find a reason to post.
And there's people like me, who don't have a machine in hand yet but who post to point out that some people's expectations for a brand new model of kit printer are unrealistic.
I'm glad for all the people who have flawless printers. But you should expect to spend some time troubleshooting, because odds are pretty good something won't work perfectly on the first try. This is a kit 3D printer, not a microwave oven. If you want a 3D printer guaranteed to work perfectly right out of the box, you need to be talking to Stratasys not Prusa.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
And there's people like me, who don't have a machine in hand yet but who post to point out that some people's expectations for a brand new model of kit printer are unrealistic.
Way back in September, I stated that we were at least 3 months out from seeing product, and then another X months worth of shakedown by the community.
We're currently in the shakedown period.
If you don't want to participate in the shakedown party, stay away from the Mk3.
So my expectations are crystal clear.
I'm glad for all the people who have flawless printers. But you should expect to spend some time troubleshooting, because odds are pretty good something won't work perfectly on the first try. This is a kit 3D printer, not a microwave oven. If you want a 3D printer guaranteed to work perfectly right out of the box, you need to be talking to Stratasys not Prusa.
What do you think causes these unrealistic expectations? I mean, that's great that you are in a solid, informed position to judge that the expectations are unrealistic, but what causes that?
Do common purchasers arrive at their expectations completely of their own accord, or are they somehow guided along that process by some mysterious source that none of us have ever witnessed?
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
What do you think causes these unrealistic expectations? I mean, that's great that you are in a solid, informed position to judge that the expectations are unrealistic, but what causes that?
Do common purchasers arrive at their expectations completely of their own accord, or are they somehow guided along that process by some mysterious source that none of us have ever witnessed?
Your point is well-taken, but unfortunately I have yet to encounter a hobby-level 3D printer manufacturer which doesn't try to give the impression that their printers are easy-to-use, hassle-free, minimal maintenance, work out of the box, etc.
Some come closer than others, but all make the claim, and none deliver.
My MK3, when it arrives (any day now) will be my 4th printer in six years (all still work, BTW). So I at least have been around the block a few times and know what the reasonable bounds of expectations should be. And I'll try to help others as best I can to keep them from being blinded by the stars in their eyes.
But I don't feel it's fair to blame one particular (probably better than average) manufacturer for the sins of the entire industry.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
What do you think causes these unrealistic expectations? I mean, that's great that you are in a solid, informed position to judge that the expectations are unrealistic, but what causes that?
Do common purchasers arrive at their expectations completely of their own accord, or are they somehow guided along that process by some mysterious source that none of us have ever witnessed?
I cant speak for everyone obviously, but i feel alot of people just dont put in the time to properly research their buying decisions.
And put to much faith in marketing, and by to much i mean like any faith at all. Marketing should be 100% ignored IMO, because every company lies in their marketing materials and makes their product sound like the best thing going. But lots of people buy into the marketing, and this is an issue.
I researched 3d printers for 6 months before deciding on the mk3, was actually going to get a mk2.5 but decided to wait it out for the mk3 as i had been wanting one for years so whats another few months.
During that time researching i realized that no printer under around $3-5k is going to be a unpack plug in and go experience. So i opted for a kit made with quality parts to teach myself how they work,and so i could learn how to repair and optimize it myself.
I think alot of people see the cheap sub $200 3d printers and realize they are crap and will require alot of tuning to work right if they can even be made to work right just by reading reviews, and think stepping up to 2-3 times the cost will magically solve those issues with the cheaper printers but not actually doing any research into just how much a plug and print printer costs, they just be assuming and not realizing that the real cost of a plug in and forget printer can easily be 5-10k.
TLDR version alot of people just dont realize how cutting edge 3dprinting is right now, and how much work goes into keeping one running well. Either due to not doing homework on the subject, or willful ignorance of buying into marketing materials.
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
I researched 3d printers for 6 months before deciding on the mk3, was actually going to get a mk2.5 but decided to wait it out for the mk3 as i had been wanting one for years so whats another few months.
Same thing for me. I own already original Prusa i3 MK2, upgraded it to MK2S. Print time is showing 143 days with PLA and ABS. So I got already a generic understanding what I can expect from the printer. It's still my workhorse printing most of the time. I did a research for my second printer and hey, what a surprise. I still think that Prusa i3 is a best overall 3D printer you can get under $1k. Sure if you need a bigger print volume, it's nothing for you, but except of that... My order for MK3 and MMU is placed and if somebody wants to cancel... feel free. I will get my stuff sooner 🙂
It seems like 3D printing is reaching the consumer market. Regular non-technical people are blinded by the commercials and youtube reviews. They don't know/understand if a reviewer started with 3D printing 5/10 years back, knowing how painful it was and now testing MK3, he sees milestones in development and huge improvements. Really good support, warranty and regular updates is something you don't see very often in this area. That's why most reviews are stating awesomeness. But what this non-technical people are expecting from MK3 is the same like from the known thermal/laser printer, Plug & Print. That's why we have couple upset people here in the forum just bashing/blaming without contributing to the development like many are doing.
Mr. Prusa keep up the good work. My money still goes in your direction!
Often linked posts:
Going small with MMU2
Real Multi Material
My prints on Instagram
Re: Cancel or not? Bad impression's ...
The only 'bad' impressions I've seen are from people who have never owned a 3D printer and quite frankly don't understand or comprehend how amazing these machines are.
Cancel your order if you like but whatever you choose to buy in its place will not be able to print with the same accuracy or reliability.
My Mk3 is my fourth 3D printer. I ordered mine as soon as it was announced. I didn't need a new printer (my Mk2s was only 6 months old) but I knew that this was going to be ground breaking and I expected some teething problems with it. (After all this is a brand new design on its first production run).
I have every confidence in Prusa to support the printer, stand by their product and also to continue to develop it. Try that with a Chinese model!
In Short:- Ignore the negative comments, they are made by people who don't know anything about 3D printing.
Buy the printer in the knowledge that it is the most advanced machine in its class. Any issues will be addressed in due course because Josef Prusa has his name on it and his reputation to uphold.
BTW: Did anyone watch the Falcon Heavy launch the other night?
All 27 engines worked, the ship held together, the payload got launched, the boosters returned to earth and landed like something out of a Gerry Anderson production... but the centre core got lost in the sea. I want my money back!