Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..  

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

I couldn't get PLA of any size to work. Finally decided to risk doing the now-unapproved cleaning routine rather than keep a useless sheet around, and now it's handling PLA and PETG like a champ. It seem to need some seasoning for PLA. 

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Posted by: bobstro

I couldn't get PLA of any size to work. Finally decided to risk doing the now-unapproved cleaning routine rather than keep a useless sheet around, and now it's handling PLA and PETG like a champ. It seem to need some seasoning for PLA. 

Will give the cleaning routine a try.. ah.. what is it?

Thanks ..

Regards

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Are you referring to Dawn and water?  I have the opposite issue.  My PETG Sticks too much.  

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Posted by: gary.s4
Will give the cleaning routine a try.. ah.. what is it?

When I finally received my textured sheet after something like 14 months, I was thrilled. Tried a series of prints and found that PLA would not adhere. I wiped it per the (new updated) instructions with 91% isopropyl alcohol and rubbed it vigorously with a paper towel. PETG adhered reasonably well, but PLA was a no-go. Assuming I had a defective coating, I contacted support and was given a hell of a run-around by someone who immediately claimed "it's a consumable" and when reminded that even consumables carry warranty against defects, sent me on an adventure of sending pictures and explaining the (extensive) testing I'd done. I was stuck with a sheet that was useless for the claimed purpose.

The reason I'm explaining this background is that I'm not suggesting everyone pursue this. However, if you're stuck with a sheet that won't work and you can't get it replaced under warranty, here's what I've done to turn my textured sheet around. This is pretty basic stuff for the smooth PEI sheets... or at least has been until recently:

1. Give it a dunk under the kitchen sink with Dawn dish soap. Use a clean plain paper towel to wash it and another to dry it. Yeah, the texture is thin and it can rust. At least I'll get some use out if it. I dried it. I'm not bathing with it. PLA adhesion was still poor at this point.
2. Give it a generous washing with acetone. I wiped it vigorously with a clean paper towel. Yeah, the PEI coating is thin and it can crack. At least I'll get some use out of it. I'm not going to repeat the acetone treatment.
3. Give it a rinse under warm water to remove any final crud, and a final vigorous wipe with a paper towel.

After doing this, the textured sheet is performing exactly as expected. PLA adhesion is excellent. I'm flipping back and forth between large PLA and PETG prints without issue, and large pieces that warped before are printing true and flat. I'm able to eliminate the stupid little brims now. I have done a mix of small parts as well, including some tall parts with small (20mm) surfaces and they gripped as well as the smooth PEI.

I don't advocate doing this, but I do feel that Prusa's support failed me. They were quick to dismiss my problem as a "consumable" (it was brand new under warranty) and provided no assistance. I can only surmise that there was some manufacturing left-over contaminants or coating on the surface. The deep clean fixed it. I'm quite happy with the sheet now and may buy another. If this one starts to fail again, I won't hesitate to repeat this treatment. It's a consumable and the warranty is meaningless. Might as well get some use out of it.

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Thanks guys .. will give it a try .. seems a shame after all the hype..

Regards

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Posted by: gary.s4

Thanks guys .. will give it a try .. seems a shame after all the hype..

As of now, the textured sheet is meeting my expectations and is quite hype-worthy. I spend a lot of time on the various reddit 3D printing groups and see the nightmares people have to deal with calibrating 1st layers and getting any sort of bed adhesion. My textured sheet is quite amazing in comparison. Unfortunately, I had to ignore Prusa's recommended practices to get it working, but after that, so far so good.

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

I have never had any problems on any  of my machines with the steel sheets. PLA and PETG adhere well enough .. no first layer problems. but PETG does raise a bit of havoc with wear and tear on the sheets .. actual all of my sheets are showing their age .. still adhere fine but it will soon be time to start replacing them..

Will give the cleaning a chance .. I would love an easy to remove PETG sheet that wears better than the steel .. How have they been wearing with usage?

Right now they list for 37 E vs 28 E for  the steel.. 

As I said at this point, I have no complaints about the steel .. just wish fro a little less wear from the PETG.. (but honestly have been printing with less and less of that lately) ..

Thanks  for the input ..

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Posted by: gary.s4

I have never had any problems on any  of my machines with the steel sheets. PLA and PETG adhere well enough .. no first layer problems. but PETG does raise a bit of havoc with wear and tear on the sheets .. actual all of my sheets are showing their age .. still adhere fine but it will soon be time to start replacing them..

Will give the cleaning a chance .. I would love an easy to remove PETG sheet that wears better than the steel .. How have they been wearing with usage?

Right now they list for 37 E vs 28 E for  the steel.. 

As I said at this point, I have no complaints about the steel .. just wish fro a little less wear from the PETG.. (but honestly have been printing with less and less of that lately) ..

Thanks  for the input ..

You will get similar results with ABS is you every try to print with it.  

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

New sheets need a work in time, after more prints parts will stick better, this is for both model of sheets.

Petg can stick to good,  to pei sheet(not powder coated), use glue stick or use glass cleaner(this leaves a layer behind).

And always let the sheet cool down, then you can remove the part, if you do this to early, you will damage the sheet.

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Working on it.. Gave the sheet a bath .. followed by acetone cleaning .. another bath .. and tried again with a Benchy ..

Benchy appeared gorgeous from the top .. but the bottom was horrid and it did not stick.. The bottom was so bad it was clear that there was a Z problem as well..

Calibrated Live Z and sure enough I am at -.750 where with the steel I was at -.425 ..  During the Live Z tuning (First Layer Calibration) the filament starting sticking as I got closer to the current setting .. currently reprinting Benchy with new Z .. and I hope for and expect much better results and the sticking problem to be well on its way to solved if not so already ..

Thanks to all  for info and guidance - @bobstro, @charles-h13, @joantabb 

I use window cleaner on PETG and do wait for cooling before removal,, still get marks on the sheet.. but as I said, I am printing with less and less of the stuff these days, actual not at all of late .. will probably swear off the PET derivatives in total .. a green thing .. starting to  just stay with Bio and Bio degradable materials.. Will have to seek a new material that fits from that perspective and can handle more demanding environments ABS is right out due to its poisons ..

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

https://blog.prusaprinters.org/how-to-print-on-a-powder-coated-sheet/

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Worked well.. According to the Prusa blog, not a good idea to use the bath+Acetone .. but will try the IPA on next print ..

End result.. Benchy stuchk and printed well .. needed the Z adjustment as well as the cleaning ..

Now to see how it stands up to time .. thanks again all ..

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Well .. back to not sticking again .. arghh .. cleaned with IPA for a nine hour print (PLA) and of course it lost its hold about 3 hours in .. I am really beginning to hate these sheets ..

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

I had a similar experience a month or so ago.  After months of printing, my printed started failing.  I tried everything and then someone suggested I look at my life Z.  Heck, it was the same setting I used for 6 months.   I found that my live Z setting was off.  I guess the Z drifted.  Looks like you are back to not sticking - odd.  

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Just a theory but it is possible I have one of the first of powder sheets.. I have had it for months and only recently tried it .. I decided to order a new one and it arrived today.. it is completely different from the first one.. I gave the new one a cleaning with the IPA and will give it a run with PLA and see what happens .. I am assuming the thing actually works and maybe I have a faulty or semi-faulty prototype .. ???

P.S.. My Z is fine, I adjusted it before I used the sheet ..

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Posted by: gary.s4

Just a theory but it is possible I have one of the first of powder sheets.. I have had it for months and only recently tried it .. I decided to order a new one and it arrived today.. it is completely different from the first one.. I gave the new one a cleaning with the IPA and will give it a run with PLA and see what happens .. I am assuming the thing actually works and maybe I have a faulty or semi-faulty prototype .. ???

 

P.S.. My Z is fine, I adjusted it before I used the sheet ..

I have 2 of the new ones and 6 of the old ones.  I have not noticed much difference.  I have two old PC TXT sheets (of the 6) that sick what too much with PETG and ABS.  I have no issues with PLA.  I have cleaned on of them with Acetone despite the suggestion.  It tends to reset the plate.  I put the acetone on a paper towel and wipe it down.  It seems to work for me when I need to do it, but I keep it to a rarity.  

Occasionally, I need to dial the printer in again.   

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Interestingly, after 2 hours on the new powder sheet, it is holding. All I did was clean it with IPA before heating & starting print ..

I will try to scrub the old one once more, and if it fails again .. Bantha fodder!

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

Your experience matches mine. My textured sheet was so bad with PLA that I ordered a pPEI sheet from Prusa. Arrives next week.

Trying to print a Pi case - for the sixth time - I gave my textured sheet an extended scrub in Dawn. Rinsed thoroughly.

Used no IPA, but I did use a skirt and the bed at 60 degrees.

This one is printing perfectly. No lift, and almost done. Maybe the sucker is wearing in... I was starting to hate it.

RE: Powdered Sheet .. PLA .. Marvin goes for a walk ..

I gave my sheet a good scrubbing with Dawn also and It now sticks less.  Since I was having the opposite problem, I am happy!