Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here  

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

But if the bottleneck is the extruder, then... how would adding the Dragon help?

It was more of a curiosity question. I have though about replacing the extruder and hotend on my Sidewinder with a BMG-style extruder and the Dragon. It already has a Titan Aero clone extruder and Volcano hotend though, so I'm not overly motivated to do this.

Bottom line: Do you recommend getting both the 0.6mm and 0.8mm matchless, or just the 0.6mm matchless?

They're not exactly cheap, but the larger nozzle can still do higher and wider extrusions, so if you like to print big things, I'd have both on hand. 

Also, since, like me,  you're in the US, where is a good place to order the matchless nozzles from?

My original 3D Solex order was a disaster. I ordered from their online store and heard nothing for 5 months. I finally tried a sales email address and got a response. At that point, they contacted a US-based reseller who shipped them quickly along with a nice handwritten note saying they can save me a lot on postage next time. 3D Solex suggests that future orders be placed with The gr5 store. I haven't had further business with them myself. They seem to be out of the "Prusa speed doubler" kits now and don't have individual nozzles listed, but they may have other stock on hand. Try emailing [email protected] (the email address on the business card) or [email protected] (the email address on their web site).

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

@bobstro

Thanks!  I just now ordered 6mm and 8mm matchless nozzles from the gr5 store.  Their website says both are in stock.  I look forward to trying them!

Last week I ordered a zcatch and one of their torque limiting tools, so maybe they will arrive in time for the install.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

@bobstro

How did you determine that the bottleneck was the extruder and not the hot end?  Which part of the extruder is the bottleneck?  Is it the extruder gears not gripping the filament well enough or is it the stepper not having enough torque?  If it's the stepper, I know of a fix that would probably work.  If it's the extruder gears, then I guess an extruder with two powered gears (not just one as in the Prusa I3 MK3) would maybe mitigate the problem?  

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

[...] How did you determine that the bottleneck was the extruder and not the hot end? 

I got to a point where specifying a faster E speed made no difference. I could specify any value and the hotend would not click. It could be a firmware limit. I don't like to fiddle with firmware on the Mk3.

Which part of the extruder is the bottleneck?  Is it the extruder gears not gripping the filament well enough or is it the stepper not having enough torque?  If it's the stepper, I know of a fix that would probably work.  If it's the extruder gears, then I guess an extruder with two powered gears (not just one as in the Prusa I3 MK3) would maybe mitigate the problem?  

I'm assuming a geared extruder would help. Again, my Mk3 is staying stock as it's my reliable printer. I experiment a lot in the Sidewinder.

As long as the filament is flowing, extruder torque didn't seem to be a problem. Did not try adjusting extruder maximums in gcode, but that's a possibility. 

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

@bobstro

Makes sense.  I too would like to have a reliable "good" printer and a separate draft printer, in part to eliminate setup times when switching between the two modes.  Not sure yet what to pick for a draft printer.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

[...]  I too would like to have a reliable "good" printer and a separate draft printer, in part to eliminate setup times when switching between the two modes.  Not sure yet what to pick for a draft printer.

A 2nd Prusa would be awesome of course. I was in a time crunch with the onset of the COVID printing push, so jumped on the Sidewinder. It's a decent printer provided you're prepared to do some work on it. The Artillery Genius is essentially the same printer in a smaller format. The Sovol SV01 is also interesting, essentially an Ender 3 with direct drive. Believe me though, manual bed leveling is really annoying once you're used to using a Prusa.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

[...] Thanks!  I just now ordered 6mm and 8mm matchless nozzles from the gr5 store.  Their website says both are in stock.  I look forward to trying them!

Do verify these are specifically for the Prusas. They've got some other 6mm nozzles, but they don't list E3D V6 compatibility. Here are my battle-weary nozzles. Notice how the hex is squared off where it meets the heater block.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

@bobstro

Thanks for the heads up.  On the pages I ordered from, it claims they're compatible with e3dv6:  https://thegr5store.com/store/index.php/1-75mm-filament-products/0-6mm-matchless-race-nozzle-for-1-75mm-filament.html

and

https://thegr5store.com/store/index.php/1-75mm-filament-products/0-8mm-matchless-race-nozzle-for-1-75mm-filament.html

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

That said, in the photos they don't look as "squared off" as yours, so I'm not sure what to make of that.

Also, yours doesn't look as though it has the chrome coating?  In your photo the color looks like regular brass.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

The pages you linked to do state E3D V6 compatible, and the one pic looks like the same shape. The pages I found showed only the sloping head. 

Mine were shiny silver out of the box. They were heavily used earlier this year, and have taken some abuse. They still print well.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @bobstro

Posted by: @dimprov

[...]  I too would like to have a reliable "good" printer and a separate draft printer, in part to eliminate setup times when switching between the two modes.  Not sure yet what to pick for a draft printer.

A 2nd Prusa would be awesome of course. I was in a time crunch with the onset of the COVID printing push, so jumped on the Sidewinder. It's a decent printer provided you're prepared to do some work on it. The Artillery Genius is essentially the same printer in a smaller format. The Sovol SV01 is also interesting, essentially an Ender 3 with direct drive. Believe me though, manual bed leveling is really annoying once you're used to using a Prusa.

 

For a draft printer, if I had the time, I might try building a HEVort.  It's an open source corexy design, and based on attempt #5, it looks as though it can run crazy fast: 

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Good stuff.  Who is gonna take the bite first and post results?

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @cwbullet

Good stuff.  Who is gonna take the bite first and post results?

Prusa with the Prusa XL.  It'll be corexy, and with such a large build volume, it will need to be fast or it would take an eternity to make large prints.  For that reason, I'm guessing it will be ~8x faster than the MK3.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Anyhow, I now routinely run at "300%" speed using an E3D V6 0.6mm nozzle and the Prusa real-time speed adjustment.  If I can push it a lot faster using the Matchless nozzles, then maybe that will be good enough and perhaps also the least hassle.

Are there good profiles for 0.8mm nozzles, or will I have to dial that in from scratch?

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

For a draft printer, if I had the time, I might try building a HEVort.  It's an open source corexy design, and based on attempt #5, it looks as though it can run crazy fast: 

Would be interested to see final print results on that. None of the walls looked particularly great mid-print. I'll have to re-watch to see if I can catch what filament he's using.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

It's quite nice that Prusa slicer lets you see both the speed and volumetric flow of your print.  I don't remember that part existing two years ago.

[Edit: somehow the upload process butchered the screen captures above, but the first one is the volumetric view and the second one is the speed view]

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

@bobstro

It would have been nice to see the HEVort print a real thing instead just a high-speed benchmark.

Looking into it a little further, I think that for its medium price I could be happy with a Voron 2.4 printing at 300mm/sec.  This video allegedly shows it printing something real (smaller size and with infill) at that speed:

Kits for the Voran 2.4 seem pretty widely available from a range of different sources.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

According to the Voron website, a (300mm)^3 Voron 2.4 might cost around $1,000 in kit parts, which you have to scrounge for  because Voron doesn't itself appear to sell anything (though a number of aliexpress vendors have picked up the slack and appear to have kits).  Not sure if that includes the Afterburner (a direct drive extruder) or not.

For roughly the same amount of money one could also buy a SecKit SK-GO, which is another corexy which got a strong endorsement from TeachingTech as the best 3D printer he'd ever tried.

I haven't heard what the Prusa XL target price is, but probably higher than that, as it is reportedly a 400mm^3 build size.  I wouldn't be surprised if it used 3mm filament to increase the effective build speed.

Anyhow, if anyone reading this has any other suggestions on high speed 3D printers worth considering, please do post.   I'm sure there must be more out there.  Given enough time  I think an obvious winner in the corexy high-speed category will eventually emerge, just as Ender 3 did for the low-end and Prusa I3 MK3/s/+ did for the medium-end.  

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Posted by: @dimprov

[...] Anyhow, if anyone reading this has any other suggestions on high speed 3D printers worth considering, please do post.   I'm sure there must be more out there.  Given enough time  I think an obvious winner in the corexy high-speed category will eventually emerge, just as Ender 3 did for the low-end and Prusa I3 MK3/s/+ did for the medium-end.  

I think we're nearing the end of big gains in FFF printing. There may be incremental gains in print speeds, but you still need filaments that can handle being printed at such speeds, and the results may not attractive. If the results are attractive, you're limited to functional prints. And FFF printing does not yield the best strength for many functional prints.

In my mind, we're at about the same stage where computer printers were in the early-mid 1980s. We were plugging along with dot matrix printers that printed one line at a time. Some could produce better results (more DPI, better fonts). Some were faster. Some were larger. All were limited to one line at a time. Laser printers showed up a few years later and changed the game completely. I don't think resin is the laser printer of 3D printing yet, but if they can get rid of the nasty chemicals and fumes, some sort of "full page" technology is going to make FFF obsolete.

In other words: I'm not spending too much time and effort on it myself. If I need a new printer, I'll look to see what's available. If the XL is out by then, I expect it will be the obvious choice.

RE: Does someone want to know how fast they can print/extrude? look here

Note on 3mm filament: The move to 1.75mm was (as I understand it) to increase the amount of hotend in contact with the filament surface to speed up melting. This is the same driver behind the Matchless nozzle design. One larger filament is split into multiple narrower paths for melting. Going back to 3mm filament might be a step backward. I suppose you could feed multiple strands of filament into a single hotend, thus eliminating run-out issues as well.