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Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon Poll is created on Dec 20, 2022

  
  
  
  
  

Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon  

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SR22pilot
(@sr22pilot)
Eminent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Bambu does sell an enterprise version which can be set to not use the cloud. However, it costs about $1K more.

Posted : 27/11/2023 11:13 am
OldCoder liked
Zappes
(@zappes)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

One could construct a conspiracy theory around that exact fact. Let me try...

So, Bambu makes a version that's not cloud-enshittyfied and it costs a lot more than such an upgrade could possibly be worth. Why would they do that?

Well, it will remove the possibility to directly steal models from companies, but then anybody willing to put up the extra money would probably not have bought their product at all with the security problem, so they at least make a hardware sale. At the same time, the higher price will make sure that practically no private user will ever buy that machine, so Bambu gets to put powerful computers with encrypted data connections into a lot of homes. Homes typically have really unsecure networks that are not being monitored for suspicious activity.

That is a perfect setup if you want to have lots of willing slaves for cyber attacks close to your target. Turning the entire installed base into a huge botnet with good internet connections and free power supply is possible in an instant. The machines in the botnet can be used as anything from jump hosts for targeted hacking to data packets cannons to be used in a DDOS attack on whatever one wants to attack. One could even mine some crypto currency on the side, just for shits and giggles. Even if one assumes Bambu to be trustworthy in the first place, this still means that a hacker infiltrating Bambu would hit the jackpot.

Now, I neither say that this is what happens here nor do I claim that Bambu acts maliciously. All I'm saying is that having powerful computers with constant internet connections that you can't inspect is a huge security risk, and it doesn't only or even mainly corporate users. I am not willing to take that risk, and while I'm not judging if somebody decides differently, one should at least try to understand this before making a decision.

My models on Printables
Posted : 27/11/2023 11:23 am
OldCoder liked
Tron71
(@tron71)
Eminent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Bambu was founded by people from DJI, which the US military has considered a national security threat since at least 2017.

If the US can't control it they will always consider it a threat! 

If you are developing for the military then everything will be firewalled or air gapped and if its not then you should not be developing for them. 

Data is probably leaving every one of your devices and going to going to companies and governments all over the world. There is very little difference if it is going to China, UK, US, France, or anywhere else as none of them are going to protect you anyway and will use your data for their own gain only.   

Posted : 27/11/2023 11:24 am
OldCoder liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

I think all the Bambu printers have a LAN only mode:

https://wiki.bambulab.com/en/knowledge-sharing/enable-lan-mode

Posted : 27/11/2023 12:29 pm
OldCoder liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Bambu lan only mode:

https://wiki.bambulab.com/en/knowledge-sharing/enable-lan-mode

Posted : 27/11/2023 12:30 pm
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

I worry about those smart Toto Toilets that wash your behinds. I shutter to think what information they are transmitting. 🤣 

All joking aside this is very serious issue that the Congress could easily do something about if they wanted to. There are just too many U.S. companies profiting from your personal information. 

Posted : 27/11/2023 12:37 pm
OldCoder and tsamisa liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Excellent point about protecting the life of the product despite the fate of the company.

I am sorry to hear about your experience with the MK4. I sat on the fence for a long time deciding whether or not to purchase tye MK4 and ultimately decided against it after reading about all the problems.  I have had such an excellent experience with my MK3S+ I really wanted to support everything Prusa, and I don't mind paying a premium for something that is rock solid and dependable.  I also was very disappointed that they would list features in their marketing materials that were not yet implemented. This was not very forthright.  That was enough for me to look elsewhere.

Posted : 27/11/2023 12:54 pm
OldCoder liked
Zappes
(@zappes)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

There's nothing wrong with the MK4 as such. The printer prints really well and seems to be quite robust - it's the firmware that gives me headaches. Version 5.1.0 has the quality level you'd expect from some backyard shop in Shenzen, and that's really not what I paid for... I do assume, though, that fixes will be made, so I would absolutely not say that I regret buying the MK4.

My models on Printables
Posted : 27/11/2023 12:57 pm
OldCoder liked
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Prominent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

 

Posted by: @tron71

Bambu was founded by people from DJI, which the US military has considered a national security threat since at least 2017.

If the US can't control it they will always consider it a threat! 

If you are developing for the military then everything will be firewalled or air gapped and if its not then you should not be developing for them. 

Data is probably leaving every one of your devices and going to going to companies and governments all over the world. There is very little difference if it is going to China, UK, US, France, or anywhere else as none of them are going to protect you anyway and will use your data for their own gain only.   

There is most definitely no data going from my Mk3s to anyhwere. 

The rest of the argument reads a bit like: "Thiefs are a reality of life, so why not inviting them all in, doors wide open, serve them lunch and then leave them alone". 

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1, Voron 2.4

Posted : 27/11/2023 1:13 pm
OldCoder and Zappes liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE:

Yes, but there is definitely data leaking from Prusaslicer over the internet. Not necessarily a bad thing, but something to be aware of.

This post was modified 3 months ago by PAUL HODARA
Posted : 27/11/2023 1:49 pm
OldCoder liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

I know I'll get some flack or laughter for this, but currently octoptrint (an open source platform) is part of my workflow and originally the MK4 did not support the full functionalty of  octoprint. I felt I could not justify the high cost of the MK4 for another bed slinger and started to look at corexy printers.

Posted : 27/11/2023 2:02 pm
OldCoder liked
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

That is an option but my printers would update until I turn the LAN off.  

Posted by: @paul-hodara

Bambu lan only mode:

https://wiki.bambulab.com/en/knowledge-sharing/enable-lan-mode

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 27/11/2023 2:11 pm
OldCoder liked
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Prominent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

 

Posted by: @paul-hodara

Yes, but there is definitely data leaking from Prusaslicer over the internet. Not necessarily a bad thing, but something to be aware of.

Do you know what kind of data specifically? I mean it is open source so people who know that stuff better than I should be able to find that out. 

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1, Voron 2.4

Posted : 27/11/2023 2:51 pm
OldCoder liked
PAUL HODARA
(@paul-hodara)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

It's not necessrily a bad thing.  For example when Prusaslicer notifies you there is an update, your local app is communicating with their online services verifying versions. I am guessing it may also communicate usage statistics and error logs.  This is all pretty normal stuff and is important for improving the product.  When you download an update the update may communicate more or less personal information. If you are concerned there are hundreds of apps some built into windows, OSX and different flavors of Linux and some standalone network monitoring tools for analyzing network communications data and connections.  At some point you have to trust them, but if Prusaslicer congratulates you on your wedding anniversary I would be very concerned.

Posted : 27/11/2023 3:43 pm
OldCoder liked
Robin_13
(@robin_13)
Reputable Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Good points.

Time to fire up wireshark and see what is being transmitted.  I find that my Octoprint tries to do the same thing checking if I am using the cloud plugin.  It was the OrangPi version that I am presently using.  When I get some time, it is being wiped.

 

Posted : 27/11/2023 7:05 pm
OldCoder
(@oldcoder)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Then that is most likely true of all of the slicers that leverage PrusaSlicer - SuperSlicer, Orca, and Bambu Lab Slicer, which are all based on Prusa Slicer.
Chris Shaker

 

Posted : 27/11/2023 7:13 pm
OldCoder
(@oldcoder)
Trusted Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

My perspective is that the MK4 kit, which I am building, didn't cost that much more than the MK3S+ kit.

I recently picked up a used Prusa Mini+. Recalibrated it, dialed the Z0 down where it should be, and it is printing great.
Added a WiFi daughter card, and have now updated it to firmware version 5.1. It's slightly faster than my MK3S+, without
input shaping, and prints just as nicely as the MK3S+. I'll mess with input shaping when I get time. I like PrusaConnect.

Chris Shaker

Posted : 27/11/2023 7:17 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

Maybe.  PrusaSlicer may check, but it is not sending an encrypted packet back to China.  

Posted by: @paul-hodara

It's not necessrily a bad thing.  For example when Prusaslicer notifies you there is an update, your local app is communicating with their online services verifying versions. I am guessing it may also communicate usage statistics and error logs.  This is all pretty normal stuff and is important for improving the product.  When you download an update the update may communicate more or less personal information. If you are concerned there are hundreds of apps some built into windows, OSX and different flavors of Linux and some standalone network monitoring tools for analyzing network communications data and connections.  At some point you have to trust them, but if Prusaslicer congratulates you on your wedding anniversary I would be very concerned.

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog

Posted : 27/11/2023 7:25 pm
OldCoder liked
Tron71
(@tron71)
Eminent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

There is most definitely no data going from my Mk3s to anyhwere. 

The rest of the argument reads a bit like: "Thiefs are a reality of life, so why not inviting them all in, doors wide open, serve them lunch and then leave them alone". 

It could be that the MK3s, which I have 2, processing capabilities and general design is just too old. 

Thieves are a reality and we shouldn't let them in, but just because your printer isn't sending data to the overlords doesn't mean that your 3D design software, OS, router, switch, or any other piece of tech isn't making up for it. 

To the best of my knowledge you can run the X1C's without an internet connection and transfer files to them using SD cards. But if you want to pay for a more expensive device with less capabilities that even the manufacturers marketing team have fudged the number on by modifying the standard Benchy, please go ahead.  

Posted : 27/11/2023 7:30 pm
OldCoder liked
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Prominent Member
RE: Prusa MK3S+ vs Bambu Lab X1 carbon

There is no hard switch to kill the X1Cs ability to call home or send whatever and thanks to tis super strong encryption and closed source the only way to get an idea what it is doing is probably to track the amount of traffic going out. 

I really couldn't care less about some useless Benchy and actually I am not even in the market for getting either an Mk4 or any Bambulab. I am more than busy with completing my V2.4. 

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1, Voron 2.4

Posted : 28/11/2023 9:33 am
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