Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread  

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

I think PR is a victim of it's philosophy of printing the parts versus casting/molding.  There are only so many parts that can be printed at one time while producing parts for other models.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @julianr

I do think though that they have learned from the aftermath, and will announce their next product only when it's really "done-done" (= only step left is ramping up mass-production) rather than months ahead.

Doubt it. They haven't learned from their previous 5 releases (mk3s upgrade kit, mmu2, mk3, mmu1, mk2s). So what makes you think they have learned now? LOL

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @julianr

[...] But yes, I get the impression Prusa bit off more than they could chew with this obviously premature announcement of the Mini. That gave them a n artificial deadline when they were still in the middle of development, and artificial deadlines make people be less exact and skip things. I do think though that they have learned from the aftermath, and will announce their next product only when it's really "done-done" (= only step left is ramping up mass-production) rather than months ahead.

I watched the original announcement and am not seeing anything I didn't expect. Initial orders shipped in December as stated. It was clear on day one that later orders would ship in 2020. We're at the 21st of January as I write this, barely 3 weeks into the new year. No surprises for anybody that wasn't reading into what he stated.

I think it was pretty clear from JP's video that they were not expecting the demand for the Mini, but that they know full well the perils of ramping up production and staff to meet an initial surge, only to layoff staff and cut back when demand ultimately slows. JP is no fool. He has built an amazing company, particularly for one not located in a major technology center, and looks to be fully committed to his team. They come first. People's expectations and wants are important, but not the top priority. He's in it for the long run. My understanding is that they will build up to a sustainable level of staff, then work as they can to reduce the queue, but that's it. Delays will improve, but it will take some time. We're all benefitting from this, even if we don't get our toys on day one. He's not out to beat Creality in sales numbers but rather produce a high quality product with as much innovation packed in as possible. It will cost more than others and it will take longer than others.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @julianr

I have to say, I'm happy to (accidentally?) have bought a halfway matured product from Prusa as my first machine (MK3, later upgraded to MK3S), else I might also have developed a different view on Prusa.

But this way, I think I was able to see what Prusa is about. They're one of the biggest innovators. ...

I totally agree - it is easier to endure if you have already done your first loop on that with Prusa 😉

Best regards,
Clemens Mödlin

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@bobstro

this. I like this approach. employees should always have priority over customers. and even if it takes longer, i opt to support people with this kind of ethics with my money over just another sweat shop.

@clemens-m

that's because you probably already own a 3d-printer 😀 for me it's the first loop with prusa AND my first printer, too. but anticipation is part of the fun. 🙂

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@strandedbandit

True! - and I am sure when they introduce the big Prusa Printer it will be the same and I will act the same. 😉 (only that I have to be faster to place my order this time)

Best regards,
Clemens Mödlin

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

I may be wrong, but there will be less demand for the XL.  

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@clemens-m if i only had the space for the big printer, I'd race you to the first places in line 😀 

@charles-h13 I think you're right, the mini probably appeals to a wider audience of people coming from outside of this hobby (me included). 

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@charles-h13

there seem to have been a lot of people bemoaning the modest capacity of the Mk3, and saying how much bigger  and better the other printers are. 

A lot of people are looking for extra Z height, which may be great for Cosplay and decorative models,   Personally I would like extra X and Y capacity to print larger functional items with 'Grain Orientation' that maximises potential strength on larger dimensions...   

regards Joan

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Most of the time I can plan out prints on my Prusa beds; however, there are some things that are simply too large in the x, y or z direction that having the ability to go out to 400x400x500 is really nice.

I also want a smaller bed that I can dedicate to printing smaller higher detail items.  

So, mini now and other brand of larger printer to tide me over until Prusa has a larger printer.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @julianr

Prusa is still a startup. You unfortunately apparently didn't realize this beforehand and the consequences it brings. Expecting a "traditional" industry like e.g. smartphones and a traditional "known brand", you sure were disappointed by Prusa.

As far as I know, PR have several products on the market, have sold over a 100 000 printers and have hundreds of employees. Their biggest problems right now seem to be related to scalability and estimating time-to-market, which are not startup problems.

They are not a startup anymore by any stretch of the word and people really should stop using it as an excuse for their questionable business practices. Same goes for the actual printers. It doesn't matter if Prusa printers are great, it's no excuse either.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@kristoffertell

questionable business-practices like...? I just see a lack of communication that should be adressed. 

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@strandedbandit

Yeah well, that's one thing. Another one is the fact that the people who pre-ordered are basically still beta testers, even though they are also paying full price for the product. I wouldn't have a problem with that if PR were actually up-front about it, but they weren't.

A better way to do it in my opinion would have been to either simply extend the beta testing (more testers, more time or both), or launch the product as the "Prusa Mini BETA", with a lower price and a VERY clear statement that it is not a finished product yet and that it is intended for people who want to help ironing out the initial kinks. Then, once you've shipped enough of those and gotten the failure rate low enough, you launch the finished product at the full price, preferably with a bit of a stockpile to meet initial demand.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@kristoffertell

I don´t get your point. I know that you are completely pissed by Prusa because of their behavior and also of shipping a beta-version (in your opinion) of the MINI. Thats ok and is your position. But why do you try to convince the community that we have to see it the same way you do?

We will not change our opinion (at least me) and I also think that we will not be able to change yours. And that is ok.
When I ordered it was completely clear for me that this would become a long journey - and now it is as I expected.

Best regards,
Clemens Mödlin

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @seth-f2

I think PR is a victim of it's philosophy of printing the parts versus casting/molding.  There are only so many parts that can be printed at one time while producing parts for other models.

That would not work very well in terms on how fast they iterate on designs. See MINI as recent example: They learned that initial thousand or so pieces had some issues with zipties being used for cables, and next revision will have different cable management. Had they made a mold and made injected plastic, or ordered such pieces, they'd now have thousands of pieces good for throwing out (recycling) and a mold that needs to be re-worked - adjusting existing mold is neither trivial nor cheap.

@bobstro

You are correct regarding long-term vision for the company - in one of interviews from 2019 for Czech Youtube channel Josef said that his ultimate goal is to build a company which he'd be able to hand over to his kids one day. That's an unimaginable long-term strategy in today's world where founders expect their startups to be bought ASAP by large companies.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@crawlerin

A well designed product doesn't need 100 iterations of it's parts. Especially if proper R&D is done before the release of said item. 

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@julianr

ya i was told they are who to go for stuff that just works =/ guess it was meant in a different way. didn't get the startup vibe either since they had a mark 3. know the alternatives are spending as much as i would on injection mold or modding the hell outta something around chinese new year.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @clemens-m

@kristoffertell

I don´t get your point. I know that you are completely pissed by Prusa because of their behavior and also of shipping a beta-version (in your opinion) of the MINI. Thats ok and is your position. But why do you try to convince the community that we have to see it the same way you do?

I am not pissed at Prusa, the whole situation is a minor inconvenience at most. What's making me more annoyed is people in this forum that keep defending everything the company does, seemingly no matter what, as if PR were some tiny hobby project run by 2 people in their parents' basement and as if the the way they do things is the only way they could possibly do it. And as if all the criticisms that people have stated here are completely unjustified, or somehow their own fault ("you should have known" etc.)

Also, I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm stating my opinion, that is all.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Posted by: @eric-c17

@crawlerin

A well designed product doesn't need 100 iterations of it's parts. Especially if proper R&D is done before the release of said item. 

Are you assuming the delay in MINI shipments is caused by plastic parts manufacturing technology? I don't think that's the case here.

RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@kristoffertell glad i'm not the only one. totally agree, would have been more ok with the whole ordeal or made a different choice if they were upfront about a the state of things.

it seems like people are invested in the company or something with how they're taking criticism